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November 17, 2009: "Backlash" 
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Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
corpen11 wrote:
I like both films, but the awards(except the technological feats) shouldn't have gone to Titanic.

That year I would've given Best Picture to L.A. Confidential, personally.

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Tue Nov 24, 2009 12:57 am
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Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
ChronoSpark wrote:
corpen11 wrote:
I like both films, but the awards(except the technological feats) shouldn't have gone to Titanic.

That year I would've given Best Picture to L.A. Confidential, personally.


Oh dear, not again!

Look, I liked "L.A. Confidential". As a matter of fact I liked it more than all of my friends and family and defended it when most of them considered it just an OK film and vastly overrated.
But it wasn't a better movie than Titanic in no conceivable way.
It's not as if it was somehow a wronged masterpiece in the mold of "Citizen Kane" or "High Noon". This is all revisionist history by some people who want to rationalize their hatred for "Titanic" by presenting an "artistic" alternative, a movie that REALLY deserved the Oscars that were bestowed to Cameron's juggernaut.


Tue Nov 24, 2009 5:37 pm
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Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
panos75 wrote:
ChronoSpark wrote:
corpen11 wrote:
I like both films, but the awards(except the technological feats) shouldn't have gone to Titanic.

That year I would've given Best Picture to L.A. Confidential, personally.


Oh dear, not again!

Look, I liked "L.A. Confidential". As a matter of fact I liked it more than all of my friends and family and defended it when most of them considered it just an OK film and vastly overrated.
But it wasn't a better movie than Titanic in no conceivable way.
It's not as if it was somehow a wronged masterpiece in the mold of "Citizen Kane" or "High Noon". This is all revisionist history by some people who want to rationalize their hatred for "Titanic" by presenting an "artistic" alternative, a movie that REALLY deserved the Oscars that were bestowed to Cameron's juggernaut.


How am I rationalizing any hatred for Titanic when just a few posts above I adamantly defended it? You can certainly have your opinion that Titanic deserved the Best Picture Oscar. I tend to think that, although Titanic was a masterful TECHNICAL achievement, you need more than just technical mastery to deserve to be named the Best Picture of the Year. I just don't believe Titanic was. I would agree that it was ONE of the best pictures of the year. I simply think L.A. Confidential is a better film, and as such, deserved Best Picture at the Oscars that year. I don't attack the Academy for giving the statuette to Titanic, and if I must be completely honest, have gotten into many a debate DEFENDING the choice of the Academy, given both the breadth of the film and its popularity. But if it was MY choice that year, my PERSONAL choice, as I think I very clearly stated, I would have given Best Picture to L.A. Confidential. So please, don't give me a presumptuous attitude and act as if I'm hailing L.A. Confidential as a "wronged masterpiece", comparing to the likes of Citizen Kane. That's completely unfair.

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Tue Nov 24, 2009 5:52 pm
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Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
Regarding films from 1997:

'Titanic' - Splendidly old-fashioned, it is done with as much skill and earns as much of an emotional pull as any grand melodrama before it. The romance may be unimaginative, but when the film turns into a reflection of the bravery, wherewithal, and sacrifice that many of the crew members were forced to display under heart-breaking duress without the immediate hope of safety or release, it becomes absolutely one of the most potent, heart-breaking, and deeply affirmative films of the 90's.

'L.A. Confidential' - Gorgeously bleak post-modern noir. Occasionally, the film is so pessimistic and cutting that it's difficult to believe it received a greenlight. Certainly, if it hadn't been made with an all-star cast and wrapped in the accessible gauze of a murder mystery, this film would have few financial prospects. The aforementioned all-star cast is uniformly excellent (although, it would be hard for any 'L.A. Confidential' die-hard to ignore the travesty of Basigner's Best Supporting Actress win), and the script is bristling with excellent dialogue. I prefer it to the more elaborate and, frankly, overlong 'Titanic', but nevertheless I don't see any travesty that either of these fine films won a Best Picture Oscars.


Other than the fact that 'The Sweet Hereafter' was better than both of them at the same time put together. Screw you, Academy.


Tue Nov 24, 2009 6:28 pm
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Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
Evenflow8112 wrote:
Other than the fact that 'The Sweet Hereafter' was better than both of them at the same time put together. Screw you, Academy.

:)

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Tue Nov 24, 2009 8:10 pm
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Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
Titanic is a sumptuous movie, both on a technical level and an emotional one. The plotline isn't wholly realistic, but the acting is good and the love is sweet. I don't even have to defend the movie's other fine achievements, they have already been spoken for. It's probably the first movie I shed a tear for. The only criticism I have is of the few historical inaccuracies such as the heartless officer who in real life sacrificed himself for the good of many people, including the poorer tenants of the ship.

"The Sweet Hereafter" probably was most deserving overall, though.


Tue Nov 24, 2009 8:27 pm
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Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
Will Hatch wrote:
Titanic is a sumptuous movie, both on a technical level and an emotional one. The plotline isn't wholly realistic, but the acting is good and the love is sweet. I don't even have to defend the movie's other fine achievements, they have already been spoken for. It's probably the first movie I shed a tear for. The only criticism I have is of the few historical inaccuracies such as the heartless officer who in real life sacrificed himself for the good of many people, including the poorer tenants of the ship.

"The Sweet Hereafter" probably was most deserving overall, though.

Of course for every one inaccuracy, there's probably three or more historical accuracies in the film. From what I've heard, Cameron was a pain in the ass to work with because of how accurate he wanted certain things. I already mentioned the carpets being exactly the same... Complete rooms were recreated down to the tiniest detail. The captain looks practically exactly the same (scarily similar). And the band that plays while the boat sinks? That actually happened as far as I know. I don't think historical inaccuracies is what I'd personally fault Titanic for.

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Tue Nov 24, 2009 8:39 pm
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Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
I would tone down some of the more outlandish scenes, sure, but I don't think the love at first sight concept is a total fantasy. Not only does it work in certain movies, it happens in real life. Just not as over the top.


Tue Nov 24, 2009 8:58 pm
Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
The biggest innacuracy is that Jack and Rose would've never met, as on the Titanic, lower and upper classes were almost always completely seperated from one another, so since Jack and Rose were in different classes, they never would've met in real life.


Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:35 pm
Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
Vexer wrote:
The biggest innacuracy is that Jack and Rose would've never met, as on the Titanic, lower and upper classes were almost always completely seperated from one another, so since Jack and Rose were in different classes, they never would've met in real life.

?
That was the whole concept of their relationship, forbidden love spanning the classes, something that should never have been possible.
Hardly an inaccuracy--more like the whole point of the movie.


Wed Nov 25, 2009 4:04 am
Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
Trevor wrote:
more like the whole point of the movie.


I tried so hard not to point this out :) Thanks Trev.


Wed Nov 25, 2009 4:58 am
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Post Re: November 17, 2009: "Backlash"
Thought of this thread a few days ago as I watched The Social Network. I found myself contemplating a question:

Did The Social Network lose the Best Picture Oscar because of backlashes like the ones discussed in JBs article and this thread.

Thought about it and came to the conclusion: No. By the time January 2011 rolled around there was a sense that Fincher's film may have been a tad overpraied. But I don't recall a massive wave of vitriol toward it or its Oscar-candidacy. In some ways what happened here was a repeat of Saving private Ryan/Shakespeare In Love. The Weinsteins went all-out in promoting their nominee and more or less assured it of victory. However, I strongly suspect that the overall verdict will turn out like the aforementioned one: In 10 years, The Social Network will be seen by much of the public as a modern classic while The King's Speech has faded away,

I've seen more backlash pop up against other films. Two recent examples are Up In The Air and The Help. A lot of people saw Up In The Air as a likely winner early on. But by mid January-early February there was a sense that the movie may have been a tad more conventional than most initially thought. The Help was never regarded as a serious candidate. But the backlash against it got so strong by the tiime the ceremonies rolled around that most people were left wondering how it got nominated for anything.

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