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Gravity Backlash? 
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
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I mostly agree with this. And I certainly don't want opposing opinions to not be voiced. But they can be presented passionately without being dickish/rude/dismissive/whatever. But the inverse is true as well: if all someone says is "Gravity sucks," that's goading as well. As you said, it must be more than just tossing out DVD-cover tidbits, but if someone has a passionate, well-articulated and meaningful explanation for their feelings that includes/concludes "best movie ever"-like feelings, there's nothing wrong with that.

The only part of the above I don't agree with is that one must be "calm." Why do lovers have to be calm when you don't expect haters to? That's senseless. Art should provoke great response. I have more respect, generally, for the films I hate than for the films I find forgettable.


That's fair.

Another issue I have with Gravity is the setup for Bullock's character, but it's not the same issue others have. NASA would never approve her as an astronaut, but you kinda accept that going in. My issue is really that her setup doesn't have an ironic side to it, so I'm just not sure how to feel about it. Being scared for her just as a person isn't good enough for me as a viewer, I need more than that. She's just one person and frankly, a good astronaut knows the risk he/she takes going up into space. They choose a higher risk life than the average person, so...I just can't be afraid for her. And going up into space is her job as a professional; she did no wrong. The reason why Deliverance and Southern Comfort, and to a much lesser extent even 127 Hours work so well for me is that the protagonists are their own worst enemies. They did it to themselves, stupidly making a bad choice and paying the consequences. I can feel sorry for them, but in a way the fact that it's their own fault makes it darker and richer. Without that aspect, all those movies would be forgettable.


Mon Jan 20, 2014 5:48 am
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
MGamesCook wrote:
Quote:
I mostly agree with this. And I certainly don't want opposing opinions to not be voiced. But they can be presented passionately without being dickish/rude/dismissive/whatever. But the inverse is true as well: if all someone says is "Gravity sucks," that's goading as well. As you said, it must be more than just tossing out DVD-cover tidbits, but if someone has a passionate, well-articulated and meaningful explanation for their feelings that includes/concludes "best movie ever"-like feelings, there's nothing wrong with that.

The only part of the above I don't agree with is that one must be "calm." Why do lovers have to be calm when you don't expect haters to? That's senseless. Art should provoke great response. I have more respect, generally, for the films I hate than for the films I find forgettable.


That's fair.

Another issue I have with Gravity is the setup for Bullock's character, but it's not the same issue others have. NASA would never approve her as an astronaut, but you kinda accept that going in. My issue is really that her setup doesn't have an ironic side to it, so I'm just not sure how to feel about it. Being scared for her just as a person isn't good enough for me as a viewer, I need more than that. She's just one person and frankly, a good astronaut knows the risk he/she takes going up into space. They choose a higher risk life than the average person, so...I just can't be afraid for her. And going up into space is her job as a professional; she did no wrong. The reason why Deliverance and Southern Comfort, and to a much lesser extent even 127 Hours work so well for me is that the protagonists are their own worst enemies. They did it to themselves, stupidly making a bad choice and paying the consequences. I can feel sorry for them, but in a way the fact that it's their own fault makes it darker and richer. Without that aspect, all those movies would be forgettable.


What about The Pianist? It's obviously not his fault he's Jewish. I don't think it makes his struggle to survive less compelling

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Mon Jan 20, 2014 9:17 am
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
Vexer wrote:
But if even if there was one I probably would not be cheering or jeering for it, I would just be largely indifferent to the whole thing like I am with the Super Bowl now.

I did use to golf with my grandfather and compared to other sports that wasn't so bad, but it's not something I really want to go out of my way to do. I do kinda like bowling if that counts as a sport.


When I was a boy I'd be watching a game on TV and rooting for a team and my Dad would ask me how much money I had wagered on the game. I'd say none and then he would ask "Why do you care who wins?" He was right, and Vexer is right, but I still have an irrational desire to pick a side and root. It must be something primal since most people seem inclined to do so. I think it applies to movies as well and is perhaps just as irrational where us non-players are concerned. Mostly harmless though.

I think bowling (and golf) are sports. Both require very precise timing and accuracy to be good, but not necessarily any special attributes of strength or speed - so I can see why others may dispute that.


Mon Jan 20, 2014 1:40 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
MGamesCook wrote:
She's just one person and frankly, a good astronaut knows the risk he/she takes going up into space. They choose a higher risk life than the average person, so...I just can't be afraid for her.

This is nonsense.

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Mon Jan 20, 2014 2:04 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
Ken wrote:
MGamesCook wrote:
She's just one person and frankly, a good astronaut knows the risk he/she takes going up into space. They choose a higher risk life than the average person, so...I just can't be afraid for her.

This is nonsense.


Agree with Ken and submit End of Watch. Knowing the risks and seeing them all stack up doesn't necessarily undermine empathy.

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Mon Jan 20, 2014 2:43 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
Ken wrote:
MGamesCook wrote:
She's just one person and frankly, a good astronaut knows the risk he/she takes going up into space. They choose a higher risk life than the average person, so...I just can't be afraid for her.

This is nonsense.


Yeah he's been amping up the absurdity lately

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Mon Jan 20, 2014 2:58 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
KWRoss wrote:
Gwaihir wrote:
Yes, we'll have two weeks of hype about Peyton Manning (which is why I will avoid ESPN like the plague until after the 2/2, and even then I'll probably avoid it, don't like ESPN)


You should see the amount of Dallas Cowboys fans where I live. It's pretty funny. I'd wager most of them have never even set foot in Texas. :roll:


They're everywhere, ugh. Bandwagon-jumping, frontrunning, etc. Hate 'em. Especially since I'm an Eagles fan.

KWRoss wrote:
Now about Gravity....


Yes, about that. Funny thing, the article Jeff Wilder posted didn't cite any examples of backlash towards the film, indeed it seems liek it's just a funny feeling the author had. It's a very odd article too, stating things like it was OK to like Titanic again when it was re-released in 3D last year. Huh? I can't think of any obvious examples of people who yo-yoed back and forth on Titanic. Indeed I don't think there was so much a backlash for that one as it was a love-it-or-hate-it film, and the critics and Academy loved it. Indeed the only things notable I can recall about the re-release is that it pushed it back above Avengers on the all-time domestic box office list, that and it didn't even earn 1/10 of the original release's take. Avatar and The Phantom Menace, yes, backlash. Gravity? I'm really not so sure. Especially since it just joined 12 Years a Slave in an unprecedented tie for the Producers' Guild best picture.


Mon Jan 20, 2014 4:57 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
MGamesCook wrote:
Saving Private Ryan is great, but has flaws which some of its advocates never wanted to talk about. That creates frustration, and I've read speculation that that frustration worked against it at the time. It also came out in July and thus had a whole 7 months to work up a backlash. Gravity, too, has problems that its advocates seem unwilling to address.
[Reveal] Spoiler:
Bullock saves clooney when she grabs hold of his tether; there was nothing to pull him away from her anymore. Yet he lets go just so bullock can cry some more. It's a rip-off of a scene from Mission to Mars, where it actually made sense.

^^^peng - the other side feels exasperated too.

I, for one, was disappointed with Gravity, and do find it somewhat overrated. For me personally, it was good, but not great. Thinking back on it now, pretty much all scenes involving Clooney post-accident only make sense if Clooney (who's character was imo a ridiculous caricature) was simply a figment of Bullock's imagination from the get go. Actually if you look at it that way, the movie works a lot better.


Mon Jan 20, 2014 5:33 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
Ken wrote:
MGamesCook wrote:
She's just one person and frankly, a good astronaut knows the risk he/she takes going up into space. They choose a higher risk life than the average person, so...I just can't be afraid for her.

This is nonsense.


Thanks for the intelligent reply, as always.

Yeah Adrian Brody's character is born Jewish. Bullocks character isn't born an astronaut.


Mon Jan 20, 2014 7:05 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
MGamesCook wrote:
Yeah Adrian Brody's character is born Jewish. Bullocks character isn't born an astronaut.

Exactly. It's like trying to muster up huge amounts of emotion when a Formula 1/Nascar/Indy driver crashes - even if it was their debut.


Mon Jan 20, 2014 7:15 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
MGamesCook wrote:
Ken wrote:
MGamesCook wrote:
She's just one person and frankly, a good astronaut knows the risk he/she takes going up into space. They choose a higher risk life than the average person, so...I just can't be afraid for her.

This is nonsense.


Thanks for the intelligent reply, as always.


I think he was insinuating a lack of intelligence in your argument; or that it was nonsensical.

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Mon Jan 20, 2014 7:18 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
MGamesCook wrote:
Being scared for her just as a person isn't good enough for me as a viewer, I need more than that. She's just one person and frankly, a good astronaut knows the risk he/she takes going up into space. They choose a higher risk life than the average person, so...I just can't be afraid for her.


So by that logic, a war film has never made you feel/fear for a soldier?


Mon Jan 20, 2014 7:51 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
MGamesCook wrote:
Ken wrote:
MGamesCook wrote:
She's just one person and frankly, a good astronaut knows the risk he/she takes going up into space. They choose a higher risk life than the average person, so...I just can't be afraid for her.

This is nonsense.


Thanks for the intelligent reply, as always.

I've given many intelligent replies to your posts, and remarks like this one gives me worry that they've all gone unappreciated.

That said, this one deserved exactly the reply that I gave to it. I don't just mean that it's nonsense in a dismissive way; I actually cannot make sense out of it.

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Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:03 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
Mission to Mars addresses the very true to life issue that if an astronaut is depressed for instance from the death of a loved one he/she is suspended. Not sure why Cuaron would ignore that. It could be that the whole thing is a fantasy but if so its a bit arbitrary.


Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:04 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
Shade2 wrote:
MGamesCook wrote:
Being scared for her just as a person isn't good enough for me as a viewer, I need more than that. She's just one person and frankly, a good astronaut knows the risk he/she takes going up into space. They choose a higher risk life than the average person, so...I just can't be afraid for her.


So by that logic, a war film has never made you feel/fear for a soldier?


With a war movie, I appreciate realism but I also appreciate real soldiers and the fact that what I'm watching are actors in a movie; not soldiers. No matter what, I could never watch Gravity and see an astronaut in peril. I'm not saying I don't have empathy for real life astronauts. But Gravity is not that. It's a movie with an actress, and I can't suspend my disbelief enough to forget that because I don't watch movies that way. I can't look at her character and see an astronaut. Instead I see a character in a screenplay who has been underwritten and which fails to take into account realistic things I know about how NASA recruits. So just to be clear, my apathy is due to the script, not to how I feel about real life astronauts. I might've phrased it badly before.

^^^Ken - sorry, didnt mean "as always." I appreciate all your posts, but hopefully I'm able to clarify my point here.


Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:15 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
Were you a fan of Moon, out of curiosity MGames?

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Mon Jan 20, 2014 11:01 pm
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Post Re: Gravity Backlash?
JamesKunz wrote:
Were you a fan of Moon, out of curiosity MGames?


It was okay but I haven't revisited it since theaters. Some interesting concepts.


Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:42 am
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