Discussion of movies and ReelThoughts topics

It is currently Sat Nov 22, 2014 1:21 am




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 374 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 15, 16, 17, 18, 19  Next
Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion 
Author Message
Auteur
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 07, 2012 12:02 pm
Posts: 3837
Location: Zion, IL
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
KWRoss wrote:
I've got another one: The Sex and the City movies. Why in God's name would you release these movies, which orgasm all over high-end fashion and materialistic characters, during the Great Recession? Hell, even releasing them now would be unbelievably offensive to so many who are struggling.

I'm not definitely a fan of the films either, but at the same time I do think it's rather silly to call the films "offensive" just cause it was released during the recession. I mean face it, some people are going to go shopping and buy those kinds of products no matter what the economy is like, so I don't really see how those films are really "offensive"(well maybe the second films portrayal of Dubai is a tad offensive).


Sat Sep 14, 2013 5:33 pm
Profile
Second Unit Director

Joined: Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:02 pm
Posts: 227
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
Vexer wrote:
KWRoss wrote:
I've got another one: The Sex and the City movies. Why in God's name would you release these movies, which orgasm all over high-end fashion and materialistic characters, during the Great Recession? Hell, even releasing them now would be unbelievably offensive to so many who are struggling.

I'm not definitely a fan of the films either, but at the same time I do think it's rather silly to call the films "offensive" just cause it was released during the recession. I mean face it, some people are going to go shopping and buy those kinds of products no matter what the economy is like, so I don't really see how those films are really "offensive"(well maybe the second films portrayal of Dubai is a tad offensive).


I agree with Vexer on this one. I'm not a fan of Sex and the City either (neither HBO TV series nor the spin-off films, which I have not seen, for the record) but I find it ridiculous to label this film as being "offensive" because it happened to be released during the recession. Keep in mind that even during the heydays of the TV series, there were plenty of Americans who were hardly doing well economically or financially.

My own issue with the show was that while there were occasional clever or witty moments, the characters themselves were for the most part simply uninteresting.


Sun Sep 15, 2013 3:51 pm
Profile
Assistant Director
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:40 pm
Posts: 805
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
JamesKunz wrote:
MGamesCook wrote:
I actually think The Rock is almost as bad as Pearl Harbor.

I think the director some critics portray Michael Bay as being is really the director he used to be. I think he's been improving steadily ever since The Island. He's found the right avenues for his style.

Ditto to Paul W.S. Anderson, whose early work I won't defend (not a Mortal Kombat fan).

Titanic is something I would defend in nostalgia only. I watched it a lot when I was a little kid. But I haven't watched it in years, and if I did, it'll probably be pretty hard to sit through.


Yeah I really get annoyed when people talk about The Rock as if it's light years better than the rest of Bay's output


Did we watch the same movie? I think The Rock is the quintessential action thriller of the past 25 years, perhaps all time. Great action that fully utilizes the R rating (refreshing after all the superhero crap), strong and intelligent writing, great performances, and a villain who is more conflicted than evil. Plus the car chase is probably the best ever filmed. And there isn't a caped man to be found!

What's not to like?

_________________
My movie review site:

Mighty Mike's Raging Reviews

http://mightymikesragingreviews.blogspot.com/


Mon Sep 16, 2013 1:17 am
Profile WWW
Second Unit Director
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2012 6:56 pm
Posts: 239
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
moviemkr7 wrote:
Did we watch the same movie? I think The Rock is the quintessential action thriller of the past 25 years, perhaps all time. Great action that fully utilizes the R rating (refreshing after all the superhero crap), strong and intelligent writing, great performances, and a villain who is more conflicted than evil. Plus the car chase is probably the best ever filmed. And there isn't a caped man to be found!

What's not to like?


:geek:

_________________
Never take a forum signature too seriously, even this one.


Mon Sep 16, 2013 3:38 am
Profile
Director

Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:44 pm
Posts: 1896
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
Quote:
Did we watch the same movie? I think The Rock is the quintessential action thriller of the past 25 years, perhaps all time. Great action that fully utilizes the R rating (refreshing after all the superhero crap), strong and intelligent writing, great performances, and a villain who is more conflicted than evil. Plus the car chase is probably the best ever filmed. And there isn't a caped man to be found!

What's not to like?


Just because we're all getting tired of superhero movies doesn't mean a movie is automatically good just because there ISN'T a superhero involved.

I thought the car chase was one of the worst I've ever seen. Connery escaping the way he did, resulting in such an extended car chase is seriously one of the stupidest thing I've ever seen in a movie script-wise (Transformers films included). It has absolutely nothing to do with the Ed Harris plot, and turns it into an entirely different movie.

Quote:
utilizes the R rating (refreshing after all the superhero crap)


Did you see Bullet to the Head or Pawn Shop Chronicles?

And Nic Cage with Sean Connery is probably the stupidest and most random pairing I've ever seen in an action movie. It's like if Zac Efron were paired with Pierce Brosnan. Completely absurd.

"Losers lose, winners go home and fuck the prom queen" or whatever the line is. It's juvenile, retarded, and not badass in the slightest. It makes Shia LeBouf sound like Einstein. Bay's humor is better than his attempts at "bad-ass-ness." Pain and Gain was brilliant because it turned the idea of bad-ass-ness on its head. Bashed it completely.

The Connery stuff for the most part feels like rotten leftovers from The Untouchables and Last Crusade B-rolls.

Moreover, the plot: Michael Bay can't do suspense. He can do spectacle and adrenaline rush. And notwithstanding, this is as generic as action screenplays get. Every movie has to have something at least a little bit original. I mean, come on. The Alcatraz location is dreary, dull, over-sized, and depressing. Air Force One and Die Hard are much better in this area.

Suffice it to say my passion against this movie is fiery and definitely burning.


Mon Sep 16, 2013 4:08 am
Profile
Director

Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:44 pm
Posts: 1896
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
Came across this post on another site, regarding The Conjuring:

Quote:
This movie was more about building suspense than throwing cheap jump scares at the viewer, which I appreciated to no end. To the right type of people, there's nothing scarier than the depths of their own imaginations, and movies that specifically allow for them to explore those depths can be utterly terrifying. Taking the movie at face value though, there's really not much shown on screen that I would describe as genuinely scary.


Is that really the general reason why people liked it?


Mon Sep 16, 2013 4:12 am
Profile
Second Unit Director

Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 12:07 pm
Posts: 373
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
That line is awesome. It's: "You're best?...losers always complain about doing their best, winners go home and fuck the prom queen."


Mon Sep 16, 2013 4:15 am
Profile
Director

Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:44 pm
Posts: 1896
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
roastbeef_ajus wrote:
That line is awesome. It's: "You're best?...losers always complain about doing their best, winners go home and fuck the prom queen."


How is that line awesome? Maybe in a different context it would be, when they're about to raid a compound in an action movie it's a cheesy trope that's been done 1,000,000 times.


Mon Sep 16, 2013 4:22 am
Profile
Critic
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2009 9:35 am
Posts: 6375
Location: Easton, MD
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
MGamesCook wrote:
roastbeef_ajus wrote:
That line is awesome. It's: "You're best?...losers always complain about doing their best, winners go home and fuck the prom queen."


How is that line awesome? Maybe in a different context it would be, when they're about to raid a compound in an action movie it's a cheesy trope that's been done 1,000,000 times.


Agreed. And coming from a Scot who's been imprisoned for 30 years, it seems like a really odd comment to make.

_________________
I'm lithe and fierce as a tiger


Mon Sep 16, 2013 6:27 am
Profile
Producer

Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 11:04 am
Posts: 2279
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
I think it's a good line and the movie is riddled with them.

Bad guy's leg/foot begins shaking uncontrollably.

Cage: You've been around a lot of dead bodies is THAT normal?

Connery: What, the feet thing?

Cage: Yeah, the feet thing.

Connery: Yeah, it happens.

Cage: Well, I'm having a little trouble concentrating, can you do something about it?

Connery: Like what, kill him again?


:lol:


Mon Sep 16, 2013 8:25 am
Profile
Director

Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:44 pm
Posts: 1896
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
Quote:
And coming from a Scot who's been imprisoned for 30 years, it seems like a really odd comment to make.


Good point, I was thinking the same.


Mon Sep 16, 2013 5:36 pm
Profile
Director
User avatar

Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2009 5:07 pm
Posts: 1602
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
Also writing in defense Of The Rock.

The Rock to me, while not quite at the top of the action movie pyramid (with Die Hard, Aliens and a few John Woo movies) is one of the better recent examples of well-done action movies. It holds up a lot better than the bulk of the more widely known summer of 1996 blockbusters (Twister, Independence Day, Mission Impossible).

The prime advantages of The Rock were good acting and a script that was self-aware and had a sense of humor about things.

You've got Sean Connery as the cynical former British agent who finds himself being forced to go along and work with people he doesn't particularly like. But he rises to the occasion because he realizes innocent lives are at stake (including his own daughters). He knows how to navigate Alcatraz and he knows how to fight. Yet he also has a sense of humor about things. Nicolas Cgae is basically a desk jockey. In the end he succeds less by turning into an action hero. But more by relying on thinking (and with much help from Connery as well). Ed Harris's general isn't some raving lunatic. He's a man whose goals are laudable even if his methods of achieving them are not.

The script is self-aware and has a sense of humor about the whole situation. That same year Wes Craven's Scream featured characters who knew they were in a horror movie and understood the tropes of the genre. The Rock didn't make this as obvious. But the characters understood the absuridty of the situation they found temselves in.

Bay's direction also works well here. He doesn't overdirect like he does on the Transformers movies he allows room to breathe. Here he's able to show that he can make an action sequence kick and allow the audience to enjoy it.

The car chase scene is well-done. However it's the one part of the movie that seems to serve no purpose except to serve up some fancy pyrotechnics. An attempt to take the chase scene in Bullitt and multiply it by 20.

Yet if that's the movie's one major flaw, why does it seems to be forgotten by much of the general public. Why do lesser pictures like Air Force One seem to be better remembered than this well-done action movie?

A few possibilities here:

The Rock, while popular with audiences and remembered well by many fans, was released just as the rules of the summer blcokbuster were changing. As was noted on another thread:

Quote:
On the other hand, this was probably the decade when big budget summer blockbusters became all about special effects and action and less about telling good stories.


In some ways it could be argued that while cinema had been moving in that direction for a while, 1996 was when it came to fruition. Consider the other major blockbusters of that summer: Twster, a triumph of fantastic special effects. But hampered by bleh characteriization. Independence Day, a film that succeeded at the time. But now comes off like smoke and mirrors.

The Rock was in some ways one of the last old guard ones, a blockbuster that reminded us that blockbusters aren't inherently dumb.

It may also be attributed to much of Bay's subsequent output. The decline (and in some cases unwatchability) of the bulk of Bay's post Rock filmography (Pain and Gain and maybe The Island excepted) has caused the baby to be thrown out with the bath water.

But either way, I like The Rock. It's not perfect no. But it's a good example of how to do a good summer action movie.

_________________
This ain't a city council meeting you know-Joe Cabot

Cinema is a matter of what's in the frame and what's out-Martin Scorsese.

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1347771599


Last edited by Jeff Wilder on Wed Sep 18, 2013 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Wed Sep 18, 2013 11:45 am
Profile
Auteur
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 07, 2012 12:02 pm
Posts: 3837
Location: Zion, IL
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
You accidentally put 1006 instead of 1996.


Wed Sep 18, 2013 12:30 pm
Profile
Director

Joined: Wed Mar 04, 2009 7:44 pm
Posts: 1485
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
Quote:
Why do lesser pictures like Air Force One seem to be better remembered than this well-done action movie?


exactly what are you basing that on? I have trouble believing that. I work in the industry, talk a lot about movies every day, and I never hear anyone mention Air Force One(even when talking about Wolfgang Peterson)
While The Rock seems to be remembered pretty fondly by many. My theory is a lot of that has to do with Connery. Movies with genuine movie stars will always be remembered more fondly as years go by than a faceless blockbuster like Twister. I'm sure I'm not the only one who frequently will tune into random Paul Newman, Bogart, Stanwyck etc flicks on TCM. Same with Connery for many I imagine. Hit movies without stars are often forgotten(you should peruse some of the box office lists by year)

Quote:
The Rock was in some ways one of the last old guard ones, a blockbuster that reminded us that blockbusters aren't inherently dumb.


Let's not go overboard. It was called incredibly dumb by the majority of critics in 1996 as I recall.


Wed Sep 18, 2013 4:47 pm
Profile
Critic
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2009 9:35 am
Posts: 6375
Location: Easton, MD
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
calvero wrote:
Quote:
Why do lesser pictures like Air Force One seem to be better remembered than this well-done action movie?


exactly what are you basing that on? I have trouble believing that. I work in the industry, talk a lot about movies every day, and I never hear anyone mention Air Force One(even when talking about Wolfgang Peterson)
While The Rock seems to be remembered pretty fondly by many. My theory is a lot of that has to do with Connery. Movies with genuine movie stars will always be remembered more fondly as years go by than a faceless blockbuster like Twister. I'm sure I'm not the only one who frequently will tune into random Paul Newman, Bogart, Stanwyck etc flicks on TCM. Same with Connery for many I imagine. Hit movies without stars are often forgotten(you should peruse some of the box office lists by year)

Quote:
The Rock was in some ways one of the last old guard ones, a blockbuster that reminded us that blockbusters aren't inherently dumb.


Let's not go overboard. It was called incredibly dumb by the majority of critics in 1996 as I recall.


I know it's the only Michael Bay movie with a positive RT%

_________________
I'm lithe and fierce as a tiger


Wed Sep 18, 2013 5:28 pm
Profile
Director

Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:44 pm
Posts: 1896
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
Quote:
a script that was self-aware and had a sense of humor about things.


For me this is a problem. The humor has to sometimes come from the viewer rather than from the movie itself. The best Bond movies take themselves pretty seriously, even though they're also fun to laugh at a little bit. But they're also fun to take seriously. It's fun to pretend that serious stuff is happening under ridiculous circumstances, if only for 90 minutes. If deep down you know it's not serious, that's all the more reason to take it seriously while you watch it. That a movie should demand suspension of disbelief is not unreasonable.

In terms of ridiculousness in general, I don't see what's so ridiculous about Rock's concept that it demands a quasi-sarcastic tone. Especially in the age of superhero dominance, I don't think The Rock could really be classified as absurd. It's probably more plausible than Taking of Pelham 123, but that movie was gracious enough to play itself straight and have a relatively short running time.

I think a movie needs to take its own material seriously at the end of the day. Or at least take its genre seriously. Otherwise it's not really a legitimate member of that genre.


Wed Sep 18, 2013 6:11 pm
Profile
Producer
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 07, 2012 6:26 pm
Posts: 2157
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
Vexer wrote:
You accidentally put 1006 instead of 1996.

I'd love to see a movie made in 1006.

In fact, I'm calling it now: if we ever figure out time travel, I'm making this happen.

_________________
The temptation is to like what you should like--not what you do like... another temptation is to come up with an interesting reason for liking it that may not actually be the reason you like it.


Wed Sep 18, 2013 6:43 pm
Profile
Critic
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2009 9:35 am
Posts: 6375
Location: Easton, MD
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
Ken wrote:
Vexer wrote:
You accidentally put 1006 instead of 1996.

I'd love to see a movie made in 1006.

In fact, I'm calling it now: if we ever figure out time travel, I'm making this happen.


Film it in Occitan, with subtitles. Like The Passion of the Christ

_________________
I'm lithe and fierce as a tiger


Wed Sep 18, 2013 10:05 pm
Profile
Producer

Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 11:04 am
Posts: 2279
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
calvero wrote:
Quote:
Why do lesser pictures like Air Force One seem to be better remembered than this well-done action movie?


exactly what are you basing that on? I have trouble believing that. I work in the industry, talk a lot about movies every day, and I never hear anyone mention Air Force One(even when talking about Wolfgang Peterson)
While The Rock seems to be remembered pretty fondly by many. My theory is a lot of that has to do with Connery. Movies with genuine movie stars will always be remembered more fondly as years go by than a faceless blockbuster like Twister. I'm sure I'm not the only one who frequently will tune into random Paul Newman, Bogart, Stanwyck etc flicks on TCM. Same with Connery for many I imagine. Hit movies without stars are often forgotten(you should peruse some of the box office lists by year)



Well, Air Force One did get a lot of really good reviews back when it came out. I know I personally love the movie. It's one of my favorite Harrison Ford/action movies. I also think it's Wolfgang Peterson's best movie (keep in mind that I have yet to see Das Boot) with The Perfect Storm and In the Line of Fire a very close second and third.

I wouldn't call Twister a great movie, but I think it's very good. I thought besides delivering on a purely spectacle level, I found the two leads, Paxton and Hunt, to be very appealing and likable. Nothing deep or anything, but just enough for me to care about them.


As much as I love The Rock, I would never say that it's perfect. It does suffer from something that a LOT of Michael Bay movies suffer from: it's overlong. And that car chase through San Francisco, as awesome as it is, was pretty pointless.


Thu Sep 19, 2013 3:37 am
Profile
Producer

Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 11:04 am
Posts: 2279
Post Re: Movies you *hate* with a fiery, burning passion
MGamesCook wrote:
Quote:
a script that was self-aware and had a sense of humor about things.


For me this is a problem. The humor has to sometimes come from the viewer rather than from the movie itself. The best Bond movies take themselves pretty seriously, even though they're also fun to laugh at a little bit. But they're also fun to take seriously. It's fun to pretend that serious stuff is happening under ridiculous circumstances, if only for 90 minutes. If deep down you know it's not serious, that's all the more reason to take it seriously while you watch it. That a movie should demand suspension of disbelief is not unreasonable.

In terms of ridiculousness in general, I don't see what's so ridiculous about Rock's concept that it demands a quasi-sarcastic tone. Especially in the age of superhero dominance, I don't think The Rock could really be classified as absurd. It's probably more plausible than Taking of Pelham 123, but that movie was gracious enough to play itself straight and have a relatively short running time.

I think a movie needs to take its own material seriously at the end of the day. Or at least take its genre seriously. Otherwise it's not really a legitimate member of that genre.


I think The Rock does take itself seriously. It's got humor in it, but not to the point where it's a comedy. It is primarily an action/adventure flick with some humor in it. It's hardly a comedy.

I think it's got a similar tone to this summer's White House Down. It's an action/adventure flick, but it's a fun one with some humor on the side. It doesn't take itself TOO seriously, but it's most definitely not a comedy either.


Thu Sep 19, 2013 3:57 am
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 374 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 15, 16, 17, 18, 19  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot], Google [Bot], H.I. McDonough, Yahoo [Bot] and 5 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by Vjacheslav Trushkin for Free Forum/DivisionCore.
Translated by Xaphos © 2007, 2008, 2009 phpBB.fr