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Is John McClane savible 
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Post Is John McClane savible
Die hard as a standalone film is a masterpiece.
It's basically a story about a normal guy "admititley a cop" who is just trying to save his wife from some terrorists
It is very self contained and although not perfect does not dwell to far outside reality.

How and ever, as the Die Hard sequels continued, McClane world became bigger and bigger.
First it was all contained inside one building.
Then is was an airport ( a seriies of buildings)
City
Country (USA)
Several countries (USA'ish Russia)

I would love to see them trying another Die Hard only this time make it smaller again.
Thriller's that take place in combined are usually way more effective becuase they are so contained ( ir Crimson Tide, Das Boot)
I would to see him in an outing with lets say his exwife , kids, grandchildren are being held.
Also no more massive explosions and life defying leaps into nothing.
Have him in the wrong place at the wrong time again.

You could have him retired, You could kill him off. Let him find out that he has cancer and he is going to die anyway and have going out with a blaze of glory.

Any thoughts?


Fri Nov 22, 2013 9:11 am
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
Quote:
Die hard as a standalone film is a masterpiece.
It's basically a story about a normal guy


It's never been a masterpiece for me. I find it a little humorless, and it's not crazy enough to be campy fun. It's not fast enough to be called a thrill ride by any means (his conversations with the police officer slow things down considerably), and there's not much visual style to speak of. The concept itself is sound, but it doesn't yield great, kinetic action scenes. Hans Gruber's death is a little anti-climactic and predictable, as are the deaths of all his henchmen. McTiernan's direction has a lot of great aspects, but there's certainly nothing unique about it and the movie feels generic at times. The cinematography sometimes isn't great. All the actors are having a good time, and it's fun to watch. Mainly I think it's too long and misses the chance to be swifter, meaner, and punchier. Still the best of its series overall.


Fri Nov 22, 2013 11:07 am
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
Die Hard, for my money, is pretty cheesy, but the cheese doesn't really hurt the movie.

It's a cliche to say that John McClane is cool because he's human--because it's true in more ways than people generally talk about. Yeah, he gets scraped up, but it's not that important. What's important is that a lot of his accomplishments spring from his intelligence and his intrepidness, rather than his physical force or his willingness to make things crash and blow up. John McCkane is arguably more interesting when he's thinking than when he's springing into action.

I think he can be saved, but they have to stop making generic action movies with Die Hard characters injection-molded into them.

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Fri Nov 22, 2013 11:42 am
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
I love John McClane and Diehard is one of my favorite movies. Having said that, I'm not sure how to save him since I long ago lost interest in his saga. I saw, and very much enjoyed, the second movie, but haven't wanted to watch another edition since. I do re-watch the original periodically when it's on TV and there's nothing else I want to watch.

Maybe he could be in the old public servant's retirement home when Gruber's son and a gang of terrorists come after him. Be kinda cool seeing him and a bunch of old police officers and firefighters gang up and defeat the bad guys. Or, moving to a new actor, a prequel of an adventure while on duty in NYC.


Fri Nov 22, 2013 1:36 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
CasualDad wrote:
I love John McClane and Diehard is one of my favorite movies. Having said that, I'm not sure how to save him since I long ago lost interest in his saga. I saw, and very much enjoyed, the second movie, but haven't wanted to watch another edition since. I do re-watch the original periodically when it's on TV and there's nothing else I want to watch.

Maybe he could be in the old public servant's retirement home when Gruber's son and a gang of terrorists come after him. Be kinda cool seeing him and a bunch of old police officers and firefighters gang up and defeat the bad guys. Or, moving to a new actor, a prequel of an adventure while on duty in NYC.

Hello CasualDad
I don't think prequel would work in this case.
He was just a normal police officer before Die hard.
Gruber's family have already been out for retribution.
Note: If they were to replace Willis, who could they get to replace him.
I offer Joseph Gordon Levitt.


Fri Nov 22, 2013 1:44 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
I'm one of the few who actually enjoyed A Good Day To Die Hard, and I really don't want to see McClane killed off, that would be just too damn depressing for me. With A Vengeance was originally supposed to have him die at the end, but thankfully the executives rejected that ending.


Fri Nov 22, 2013 2:23 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
p604 wrote:
Hello CasualDad
I don't think prequel would work in this case.
He was just a normal police officer before Die hard.
Gruber's family have already been out for retribution.
Note: If they were to replace Willis, who could they get to replace him.
I offer Joseph Gordon Levitt.


Joseph Gordon Levitt does resemble him in stature and I think would make a good wise-cracking police officer. Even though he was an ordinary cop, maybe they could have him involved in some hush-hush occurances at the UN or something. Not sure if anyone else could pull off the personality that Willis brings to the role, but it might be an interesting thing to attempt. Interactions with his leadership would be funny and confrontational like they were with the Feds in the original movie. I really do like the character and need to make the time to watch the later sequels.

Another idea for the old guy - he's out in the wilderness with some friends (hunting, fishing, smoking weed, ...some reason to be outdoors) and runs afoul of some radical extremist group with all sorts of weaponry. Diehard with a Deliverance.


Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:45 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
CasualDad wrote:
p604 wrote:
Hello CasualDad
I don't think prequel would work in this case.
He was just a normal police officer before Die hard.
Gruber's family have already been out for retribution.
Note: If they were to replace Willis, who could they get to replace him.
I offer Joseph Gordon Levitt.


Joseph Gordon Levitt does resemble him in stature and I think would make a good wise-cracking police officer. Even though he was an ordinary cop, maybe they could have him involved in some hush-hush occurances at the UN or something. Not sure if anyone else could pull off the personality that Willis brings to the role, but it might be an interesting thing to attempt. Interactions with his leadership would be funny and confrontational like they were with the Feds in the original movie. I really do like the character and need to make the time to watch the later sequels.

Another idea for the old guy - he's out in the wilderness with some friends (hunting, fishing, smoking weed, ...some reason to be outdoors) and runs afoul of some radical extremist group with all sorts of weaponry. Diehard with a Deliverance.

That sounds pretty interesting, another cool idea would be have to him go up against his police unit which has since become corrupted.


Fri Nov 22, 2013 6:07 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
I say stick a fork in the Die Hard franchise. It completely jumped the shark with #4.

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Fri Nov 22, 2013 7:06 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
Sexual Chocolate wrote:
I say stick a fork in the Die Hard franchise. It completely jumped the shark with #4.

This.


Sat Nov 23, 2013 12:59 am
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
I was never a big fan of the Die Hard series. The first one is a decent or even good action movie. It does not mark the pinnacle of the action genre, though, and it quite a bit overrated, in my opinion. With the exception of the third movie, which I consider to be a borderline self-parody and which has more in common with buddy cop movie à la 'Lethal Weapon' than the other 'Die Hard' movies, the other 'Die Hard' films aren't worth watching, though, and are getting progressively worse.

So the answer to the original question is No, John MacClane's time as an action hero are over and have been for quite some time.


Sat Nov 23, 2013 6:29 am
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
Unke wrote:
I was never a big fan of the Die Hard series. The first one is a decent or even good action movie. It does not mark the pinnacle of the action genre, though, and it quite a bit overrated, in my opinion. With the exception of the third movie, which I consider to be a borderline self-parody and which has more in common with buddy cop movie à la 'Lethal Weapon' than the other 'Die Hard' movies, the other 'Die Hard' films aren't worth watching, though, and are getting progressively worse.

So the answer to the original question is No, John MacClane's time as an action hero are over and have been for quite some time.

I read the read that the concept for the third film was originally setup for a lethal weapon film so the comparison is apt. think that this character is savable. They just need to make his situation smaller


Sat Nov 23, 2013 5:39 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
Has any movie franchise been savable 5-6 movies in? I guess some people will saw the Fast & the Furious franchise was saved, but I haven't seen those (I just know fans love the 5th and 6th entries). I'd argue that, at this point, anyone who still cares about John McClane and his series of adventures is probably in for the long haul already. Anyone who's already out (like myself), probably isn't jumping back in.

I saw someone suggested Gordon-Levitt to replace him. Please, no. I can't even watch Looper on TV because the attempts to make him look like Bruce Willis are so damned distracting.


Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:22 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
I didn't realize for a while in Looper that JGL was supposed to look like Bruce Willis. I just thought looked like he had some kind of allergic reaction.

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Mon Nov 25, 2013 6:57 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
PeachyPete wrote:
Has any movie franchise been savable 5-6 movies in?


Rocky Balboa saved the series in my opinion. At least it went out on a much better note than Rocky 5.

Predators saved the series from becoming even more dogshit after AVP and AVP requiem. It took the series back to what makes the first Predator so fucking awesome.

Maybe Terminator 5 will save the series from the abysmal Salvation.

Star Trek: Frist Contact was a huge breath of fresh air and put the series back on track (until the next 2 installments derailed it again).


Personally, I like when creative forces find new, exciting, and inventive ways to continue a series or character. I'd much rather endure a # 5 of something (if it is handled well), rather than rebooting the thing and starting from scratch. I hope the new Indiana Jones and Jurassic Park get the series back to what made them timeless in the first place.


Mon Nov 25, 2013 7:33 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
Well, count me as one of the few viewers who didn't notice or care about Gordon-Levitt's makeup in Looper. For an example where bad makeup totally yanks you out of the experience, look no further than Cloud Atlas. Yikes.

As for the topic at hand, I'm not sure John McClane is salvagable. Is there anything special about him that sets him apart from other action heroes anymore? Once upon a time, sure, but now he's a carbon copy of so many other action heroes that have come and gone since he burst on the scene. If you can't give him anything better than a middling February release movie, it's time to move on.

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Mon Nov 25, 2013 7:42 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
PeachyPete wrote:
Has any movie franchise been savable 5-6 movies in?


Fast & Furious.


Mon Nov 25, 2013 7:51 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
peng wrote:
PeachyPete wrote:
Has any movie franchise been savable 5-6 movies in?


Fast & Furious.

Agreed, I also personally quite enjoyed the AVP films, Predators was merely OK for me. Prometheus on the other hand sucked for me.

Enjoyed Salvation and am looking forward to T5.

I like all of the Star Trek films with the exception of the first movie, Nemesis is one of my favorites and deserved to do so much better at the box-officen then it did.

I like JGL, but yeah his makeup in Looper did look pretty damn awful and it made it impossible for me to take those scenes seriously.


Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:06 pm
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
I love Looper and think JGL was excellent in it.

Nemesis is severely underrated but so is Insurrection IMO. Both movies tell compelling stories unlike Into Darkness, which all it does is regurgitate the past and pretty badly at that.


As for the question: Is John McClane savable? Of course he is. But then again, IMO, I thought Live Free or Die Hard was pretty awesome. A Good Day to Die Hard was horrible, yes. But I don't think one bad movie can ruin a long running franchise.


Tue Nov 26, 2013 3:15 am
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Post Re: Is John McClane savible
ilovemovies wrote:
I love Looper and think JGL was excellent in it.

Nemesis is severely underrated but so is Insurrection IMO. Both movies tell compelling stories unlike Into Darkness, which all it does is regurgitate the past and pretty badly at that.


As for the question: Is John McClane savable? Of course he is. But then again, IMO, I thought Live Free or Die Hard was pretty awesome. A Good Day to Die Hard was horrible, yes. But I don't think one bad movie can ruin a long running franchise.

Disagree on Into Darkness, I actually like that one better then Wrath Of Khan.


Tue Nov 26, 2013 3:31 am
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