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Ben Affleck says I'm Batman! 
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
KWRoss wrote:
Would anyone else be okay with a one-year moratorium on superhero movies altogether? Not only are there a ridiculous number of them released each year, but it seems to be where 90% of everyday dialogue regarding movies is concentrated. Obviously, it isn't realistic to have this because they're one of the few proven moneymakers in the business, but hypothetically speaking, I'd kind of enjoy a one-year break from it.


I'd certainly enjoy it too. The Dark Knight Rises last year was kind of the turning point for me. After that film, superhero fatigue kicked in and I haven't been able to muster up any interest in the superhero films this year (Man Of Steel is the only one I've seen).

But Vexer's right. As long as these movies don't completely bomb at the box office, there won't be any significant break coming. I'm starting to wonder if we're closing in on that point though. Are people really going to show up in droves for Guardians Of The Galaxy? With Bradley Cooper as the voice of Rocket Raccoon? Does that kind of announcement mean anything to people outside of the comic community, or will more mainstream audiences buy into it simply because the film will be hyped as part of "Phase 2" leading up to the next Avengers film?

MGamesCook wrote:
Good point, I'd be down. But the main issue for me is talking about movies that haven't been made yet. It's an unbalanced seesaw, 2 years of hype on one side, 2 hours of actually watching the movie on the other. This is expounded upon well in this article:

http://wegotthiscovered.com/movies/dear ... man-years/

Whose main point is essentially that the news has unfairly distracted from a much more immediate item of interest: The World's End. Also talks about how the internet lives in the hypothetical future and not the present.


That bolded part of your post is what bothers me the most too. The Amazing Spider-Man 2 isn't even out yet, and already I'm seeing stories and speculation on The Amazing Spider-Man 3 and The Amazing Spider-Man 4. You can't read a story about an upcoming Marvel movie without mention of the "Phase 2" and "Phase 3" movies that will follow it. And apparently nobody is content with just anticipating Star Wars Episode 7; everyone has to speculate on Episodes 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, and however many spinoffs that are currently being planned. I can sympathize a lot with that article's message, specifically the author's feeling of exhaustion.

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Sat Aug 24, 2013 3:34 pm
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
Big movie companies don't make movies anymore. They make events. This has pretty much been true ever since the first Michael Keaton Batman movie.

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Sat Aug 24, 2013 3:45 pm
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
Know your movie history Ken it's been true ever since Wings went overbudget trying to use actual airplanes as props for the dogfight scenes.

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Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:02 pm
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
thered47 wrote:
Know your movie history Ken it's been true ever since Wings went overbudget trying to use actual airplanes as props for the dogfight scenes.


I would say there is something specific here that's only been going on for around 20-25 years as Ken suggests. You can see shadows or hints of it in older movies, but only shadows and hints.

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everyone has to speculate on Episodes 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15


Lucas himself was always guilty of this. Episode 3 was nice if only to see him finally settling down and focusing on a single story.

Personally, I love the idea of a movie franchise. If a movie is good, I have no problem seeing it "done again" so to speak, but with a different story. My problem is with the conceit of a story that takes several movies to tell. I'm strongly against that. The whole point of the cinematic medium is to tell a story in one sitting. When I sit down to watch something, the story better be over by the time I stand up. That's one of the most important advantages of the medium. Probably the most important. It's what makes movies a unique medium for storytelling.


Sun Aug 25, 2013 12:36 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
Personally, I was not particularly pleased that the next Man of Steel film will feature Bruce Wayne/Batman, since I really wanted the next film to show the dichotomy between Superman and his Clark Kent alter ego, as well as to expand on his relationship with Lois Lane, not to mention his facing villains like Lex Luthor or even Brainiac. Although at the same time, I wasn't surprised about the news, since having Batman in the next film will be a segue to a new Justice League film franchise.

Now more specifically on Affleck as Bruce Wayne/Batman, I feel that any actor will face an uphill battle in portraying this role given that Christian Bale's performance in the Nolan Dark Night trilogy is so fresh in people's minds. At the same time, Affleck has grown over the years to become a capable actor (and director) and I don't think he's any worse a choice than the other potential actors whose names were thrown around (e.g. Ryan Gosling, Josh Brolin, Richard Armitage).

Furthermore, before we start bashing Affleck, remember that there were plenty of doubters with regards to Michael Keaton being cast in the Tim Burton Batman film, and the consensus is that his portrayal was relatively successful. Also, I recall there were many people who were skeptical of Heath Ledger as the Joker, and his performance was amazing!

So I think we should all give Affleck the benefit of the doubt, and wait until the film is actually made and released before we start judging.


Sun Aug 25, 2013 10:46 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
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Furthermore, before we start bashing Affleck, remember that there were plenty of doubters with regards to Michael Keaton being cast in the Tim Burton Batman film, and the consensus is that his portrayal was relatively successful. Also, I recall there were many people who were skeptical of Heath Ledger as the Joker, and his performance was amazing!

So I think we should all give Affleck the benefit of the doubt, and wait until the film is actually made and released before we start judging.


The Tim Burton's Batman movies are probably the most overrated films in existence and Micheal Keaton was just adequate as Batman. Nolan's version and casting surpasses them in every single way except Christian Bale was just okay in the role. It kind of like watching people trying to replace Sean Connery as Bond with each new actor being just okay till we get to Daniel Craig who really takes the role back and owns it despite cries of alarm from everyone. Could Ben Affleck pull off a Daniel Craig and become the definitive Batman that everyone sets the bar to which I feel has not happened yet. I am kind of betting against as I don't think he has kind of range but will be just a bland and adequate replacement. Sort of the George Lazenby of Batman.


Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:30 pm
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
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The Tim Burton's Batman movies are probably the most overrated films in existence


The one with Danny DeVito has a zaniness to it which I think makes it the best Batman movie to date. It's also most what I would imagine a Batman movie to be. The material is not the stuff of somber crime procedurals. Batman is really a quirky, offbeat concept. A quirky, offbeat director is what he needed. However, I don't like the one with Nicholson even though I prefer his performance to Ledger's. But Burton's first movie is statically staged and poorly paced.


Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:40 pm
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
oakenshield32 wrote:
The Tim Burton's Batman movies are probably the most overrated films in existence and Micheal Keaton was just adequate as Batman. Nolan's version and casting surpasses them in every single way except Christian Bale was just okay in the role. It kind of like watching people trying to replace Sean Connery as Bond with each new actor being just okay till we get to Daniel Craig who really takes the role back and owns it despite cries of alarm from everyone. Could Ben Affleck pull off a Daniel Craig and become the definitive Batman that everyone sets the bar to which I feel has not happened yet. I am kind of betting against as I don't think he has kind of range but will be just a bland and adequate replacement. Sort of the George Lazenby of Batman.

I realize this is off-topic, but the Bond actors aren't really analogous here. There's no Sean Connery, because none of the actors until Bale really had an approach to the character. There's no Lazenby, because Lazenby's failing (probably not even his fault) was that he imitated Connery instead of playing Bond his own way.

Well, Kevin Conroy is Sean Connery, but that's kind of irrelevant to the movies.

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Sun Aug 25, 2013 5:35 pm
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
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I realize this is off-topic, but the Bond actors aren't really analogous here. There's no Sean Connery, because none of the actors until Bale really had an approach to the character. There's no Lazenby, because Lazenby's failing (probably not even his fault) was that he imitated Connery instead of playing Bond his own way.


I think is is perfectly analogous as there is always debate and speculation about who is going to be iconic characters like Bond,Batman,Superman,Doctor Who and etc. The difference is when one actor becomes so associated with a role the public has trouble seeing anyone else in the part and the debate becomes more derisive. Batman has not had that problem as no one has owned the part in the public's mind. Connery though overshadows all the Bonds and just like Robert Downey will be a problem for the new Tony Stark actor. If someone had come along and said Affleck would be Bond after Craig there would be even more outrage at the miscasting.


Sun Aug 25, 2013 7:40 pm
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
MGamesCook wrote:
Good point, I'd be down. But the main issue for me is talking about movies that haven't been made yet. It's an unbalanced seesaw, 2 years of hype on one side, 2 hours of actually watching the movie on the other. This is expounded upon well in this article:

http://wegotthiscovered.com/movies/dear ... man-years/

Whose main point is essentially that the news has unfairly distracted from a much more immediate item of interest: The World's End. Also talks about how the internet lives in the hypothetical future and not the present.


I love this article. It sums up how I feel right now about this. JB wrote about something similar in a Reelthought about how anticipating a big movie is like waiting for Christmas morning. The buildup is long and intense, but when the event actually comes, it's over in a flash. And that's exactly why these superhero flicks are getting on my nerves. The actual experience of watching one can be a lot of fun, and that's typically what I focus on. But for most, it's more about the insane level of nerd-ish hype involving the casting and which characters filmmakers will include.

You see this sort of thing in sports a lot, too, where things like steroid scandals, free agency, and drafts can sometimes overshadow the games themselves. I find it ten times more annoying when it comes to movies.

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Sun Aug 25, 2013 10:45 pm
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
Whoever follows Daniel Craig will certainly have an uphill battle. But if you look at it logically, Batman wears a mask...so he should be a lot easier to recast than some of these other characters. And I think it would be pretty difficult for Affleck to mess up the Bruce Wayne side of it. The part isn't Hamlet, after all :roll:

My personal suspicion is that people aren't really thinking of Affleck, but are instead disappointed that Christian Bale might not be the definitive Batman for their children and grandchildren when only a year and a half ago it seemed like Nolan might have the final word on the character. Now not only will Affleck be Batman in what will very likely become the "definitive DC series" so to speak, but the implication is that we may get even more Batman actors as the years wear on. I wouldn't expect The Joker not to return either in the long run. I'm sure Snyder would love to have a crack at him.

The Bond comparison is most analogous in the sense that these characters don't belong specifically to Mendes, Nolan, Snyder, Bale, Reeve, or Heath Ledger. Or the fans. They only belong to themselves. That was part of my problem with The Dark Knight series. Nolan became too much the landlord instead of the tenant.


Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:26 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
oakenshield32 wrote:
Quote:
Furthermore, before we start bashing Affleck, remember that there were plenty of doubters with regards to Michael Keaton being cast in the Tim Burton Batman film, and the consensus is that his portrayal was relatively successful. Also, I recall there were many people who were skeptical of Heath Ledger as the Joker, and his performance was amazing!

So I think we should all give Affleck the benefit of the doubt, and wait until the film is actually made and released before we start judging.


The Tim Burton's Batman movies are probably the most overrated films in existence and Micheal Keaton was just adequate as Batman. Nolan's version and casting surpasses them in every single way except Christian Bale was just okay in the role. It kind of like watching people trying to replace Sean Connery as Bond with each new actor being just okay till we get to Daniel Craig who really takes the role back and owns it despite cries of alarm from everyone. Could Ben Affleck pull off a Daniel Craig and become the definitive Batman that everyone sets the bar to which I feel has not happened yet. I am kind of betting against as I don't think he has kind of range but will be just a bland and adequate replacement. Sort of the George Lazenby of Batman.


I agree that the Nolan's version of the Dark Knight trilogy far surpasses all of the previous Batman films, but I completely disagree with you that Christian Bale was only okay; in fact, I consider Bale to be the best actor to portray Bruce Wayne/Batman. To use your Bond analogy, Christian Bale is the Sean Connery or Daniel Craig of the Batman franchise.

As to whether Affleck could pull off a Daniel Craig and become the definitive Batman, that is hard to say, because I'm not certain because Batman will only be a secondary character in the new Man of Steel film -- remember that Superman is the main hero for this film, so Affleck won't really have the chance to develop Batman in the way that previous Batman films have allowed. That being said, I still feel that Affleck could pull off giving a competent, capable performance as Batman. Continuing your Bond analogy, Affleck could be a Pierce Brosnan, as opposed to Daniel Craig.


Mon Aug 26, 2013 8:36 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
I don't think Affleck will be as great as Bale, but then again I don't think anybody will ever be as great as Bale. And that's largely because I don't think anybody is ever going to top the Nolan movies. The Nolan movies will forever be THE definitive Batman story. It ties with the Lord of the Rings as my favorite trilogy of all time.

But, having said that, I do think the flack Affleck is getting on the internet is ridiculous and people should give him a chance. The movie hasn't even begun filming for crying out loud.

As I said before, I think if anybody is going to ruin the franchise, it won't be Affleck, it'll be Zack Snyder. I was somewhat disappointed with Man of Steel. I HATED the fight scenes. The final showdown between Supes and General Zod was fine, but otherwise, all of the fight scenes in the second half were a mess and incoherent. I hope he does better with the sequel.


Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:21 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
ilovemovies wrote:
I don't think Affleck will be as great as Bale, but then again I don't think anybody will ever be as great as Bale. And that's largely because I don't think anybody is ever going to top the Nolan movies. The Nolan movies will forever be THE definitive Batman story. It ties with the Lord of the Rings as my favorite trilogy of all time.

But, having said that, I do think the flack Affleck is getting on the internet is ridiculous and people should give him a chance. The movie hasn't even begun filming for crying out loud.

As I said before, I think if anybody is going to ruin the franchise, it won't be Affleck, it'll be Zack Snyder. I was somewhat disappointed with Man of Steel. I HATED the fight scenes. The final showdown between Supes and General Zod was fine, but otherwise, all of the fight scenes in the second half were a mess and incoherent. I hope he does better with the sequel.

They're both going to fuck up the franchise. Snyder is a hack.

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Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:27 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
ilovemovies wrote:
The Nolan movies will forever be THE definitive Batman story. It ties with the Lord of the Rings as my favorite trilogy of all time.
This is asinine. They're not even the definitive Batman story right now.

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Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:54 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
Quote:
all of the fight scenes in the second half were a mess and incoherent.


No, you may not have liked them, but to say they're incoherent is objectively incorrect. That's like saying Man of Steel was in black and white. The action in Man of Steel is seamlessly continuous, I could prove it to you one shot at a time.

Quote:
The Nolan movies will forever be THE definitive Batman story. It ties with the Lord of the Rings as my favorite trilogy of all time.


I disagree. I think they suck. We both have rights to opinions, that's not the problem. The problem is...

You have no knowledge of what future Batman movies will be like.

It's fine to say Bale is better than Keaton, Kilmer, and Clooney. That's the past. Same way it's fine to say Connery is better than Moore or Moore better than Dalton or whatever.

But when you tell me Bale is the definitive Batman for ALL TIME, in other words the rest of my natural life and everyone else's on this board, for the natural lives of my children and great great grandchildren, that's really dispiriting. Seriously, you have a right to express your opinion about things which have already happened. Don't like Man of Steel? No problem. But you don't have the right to write off an entire chunk of my life or anyone else's before it has even happened. That's like saying there will never be a better action scene than the freeway chase in Fast 6. NEVER.

The nice thing about life is that there's always another day, and the nice thing about movies is that there's always more of them. Life is long. Neither you nor I know whether The Dark Knight trilogy will still be popular 70 years from now when we're old. It's good to keep things in perspective. I'm sure many Bond fans in the 70s were disappointed that their kids were growing up on Roger Moore, but you can't stop the onward march of time. The future means unlimited possibilities. I don't mean to be overly-heavy and existential but that's the only way I know to put it.


Tue Aug 27, 2013 3:04 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
ilovemovies wrote:
I don't think Affleck will be as great as Bale, but then again I don't think anybody will ever be as great as Bale. And that's largely because I don't think anybody is ever going to top the Nolan movies. The Nolan movies will forever be THE definitive Batman story. It ties with the Lord of the Rings as my favorite trilogy of all time.

But, having said that, I do think the flack Affleck is getting on the internet is ridiculous and people should give him a chance. The movie hasn't even begun filming for crying out loud.

As I said before, I think if anybody is going to ruin the franchise, it won't be Affleck, it'll be Zack Snyder. I was somewhat disappointed with Man of Steel. I HATED the fight scenes. The final showdown between Supes and General Zod was fine, but otherwise, all of the fight scenes in the second half were a mess and incoherent. I hope he does better with the sequel.


The fight scenes are a problem for me too. I like to vaguely know what's going on, and in much of these, I had no effing clue.

I don't think Snyder his a hack. When he takes his foot off the pedal, he shows some good stuff. The opening sequence of Watchmen showed visual talent and even an appreciation for history. The slower scenes in Man of Steel, especially those with Kevin Costner, also show a deft you wouldn't usually associate with Snyder. But Man of Steel is sometimes too much, too quick.

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Tue Aug 27, 2013 5:08 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
Ken wrote:
ilovemovies wrote:
The Nolan movies will forever be THE definitive Batman story. It ties with the Lord of the Rings as my favorite trilogy of all time.
This is asinine. They're not even the definitive Batman story right now.


Well, I don't read comic books so I suppose I should restate what I said to: it's THE definitive Batman story in terms of movies. And that's a statement I stand by. Now could I be wrong? Could their be a future Batman film that surpasses Christopher Nolan's work? Sure. But I don't see it happening. That's how much I love Nolan's Batman trilogy. At least not in my life time.


Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:22 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
Can't really get caught up in the whole bruhaha over this. Can Affleck play Batman? I won't know until I've seen it. In the wake of Daredevil my initial reaction would have been "no way". But since then he's done stuff that's proven me wrong.

However I do agree with JB's assertion that Affleck is not really an action star. He's better suited for comedies and dramas.

The thing that annoys me here is that this will probably delay Affleck's next directorial effort, his adaptation of the Dennis Lehane novel Live By Night.

I think my apathy about this (as well as Man Of Steel) is due to a sense of superhero fatigue I'm starting to feel. After TDKR and The Avengers last year and this year Iron Man 3, I'm superhero'd out. I can't muster nay real excitement for Thor or Captain America either.

I suspect that the reason they may have decided to do this Superman/Batman film right now is because they may have realized that in the wake of the two major superhero films of last year, standalone superhero movies are limited. They need to go above and beyond if they want to stand out. Iron Man 3 proved that going back to standalone Avengers movies isn't going to cut it.

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Tue Aug 27, 2013 10:16 am
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Post Re: Ben Affleck says I'm Batman!
I don't have a real opinion here, I just like that the title of the thread makes it sound like Patrick is bragging.


Tue Aug 27, 2013 6:48 pm
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