Citizen Kane was not just influential in its effects, but in its use of those effects (and other elements of cinema) as storytelling techniques. Perhaps if Star Wars had come out in 1941...

Well, that's what I'm saying. Both films basically accomplished the same thing in terms of effects, its just that Star Wars obviously used more advanced tech. But is Kane a better film because it was first? Kane is a landmark movie, but because of that, I think it is somewhat blown out of proportion. If you take technical innovation out of the equation, where does that leave you?

What do you mean by technical innovation? If you're just talking about the sophistication of visual effects, then yeah, Star Wars was a pretty big leap forward, just as Kane was. But Kane's technical innovations are so far beyond visual effects. Kane's most important trait is that it took a swirl of storytelling techniques and codified them into a working language. It drew upon the often contradictory ideas of composition, editing grammar, sound, camera movement, etc., that were present in cinema so far and boiled them down in a way that hasn't been significantly improved upon since.

And of course it matters what was first. Films aren't born into a vacuum. They have decades (a century at this point) of shoulders to climb on. If you look at your family tree, you can't just switch your name with the name of someone who lived several generations back and expect the lineage to still make sense.

Sight and Sound trends aside, I think the first two Godfathers come as close as anything ever will to truly unseating Kane. They're still probably the most profound merging of critical and popular tastes for all time. What's cool about them is that they literally did nothing conceivably new; they were just timelessly good.

"Citizen Kane" may very well be the most influential and most ahead-of-its-time-at-the-time-of-its-release from a purely technical standpoint... but my lesser interest in the story it tells (and the rather dry tone in which it's told) will always keep it slightly at arm's length for me. "Vertigo," on the other hand, I've never gotten all the fuss; apart from the titles and the dream sequence, nothing much else blew my mind about that film. And, as an actor myself, I still don't fully buy Jimmy Stewart's transformation into an obsessive creep.

I've been a bit surprised by Vertigo's ascension; though I think it's very good, it's not a "best movie ever" type for me.

Doesn't it seem to be missing many of the things which made Hitchcock so popular? That's no doubt why auteurists love it. Like Rio Bravo, it's arguably just a hindsight classic in their eyes.

For many years Citizen Kane was my fave film of all time. A few years ago that changed.

I wrote

"As the film stopped for the second time in two days I sat there and realized something that I did not believe was possible. This film that had so disappointed me all those years ago, now had its hooks so deep into me. I looked at the books that I had bought, the DVD’s, the soundtrack and realized that I had just watched my favorite film of all time. Of course “Citizen Kane” is more important, is technically more brilliant and a greater piece of showmanship. But “Vertigo” has a story and themes combined with a style that for me trump the brilliance of Orson Welles. I know that an objective shoot out between these two movies is ridiculous. All anyone can do is look at how a film affects them and how they feel afterwards. After “Vertigo” I was drained.

The whole purpose of this trip had been to discover new movies, directors and ideas. To revisit old friends and see how I felt about them after the recent deep immersion in great cinema. The ascension of this film to my personal cinematic summit was complete and my “Vertigo” had been confirmed.

10/10
Rob"

Come back, Rob!

Pedro,

This is very kind. I hope you're well. I so enjoyed meeting you at that garage sale

I left the forum because I needed to take a life decision about my time. It had nothing to do with anything or anyone here. In fact, I lurk and keep checking.

I am now very active within one of the largest single breed (German Shepherd) dog rescue operations. I have fostered 14 dogs, own one and do adoption counseling and all sorts of other stuff. It's insanely rewarding to save so many dogs lives. It's my joy in life and defines me far more than work, collecting DVDs or anything else in my spare time.

I've now seen 707 of the top 1000 movies and have not been to the cinema this year. I did not even bother to watch the Oscars for the 2nd year running. The only film reviews I read are from old classics after I've watched the films. No disrespect, but I don't need James or anyone to tell me that American Reunion is a waste of my life.

I regret that the likelihood of me coming back is almost nil and it's got nothing to do with anyone here. That said, I genuinely miss my times on the forum and wish everyone great movies and happiness.

Kindest regards
Rob

Wow - just looked at the traffic and the forum is so slow
What happened?
Rob

Well Rob, i'm really glad to hear that you're doing a job you really enjoy doing, my ideal job is to be a high school counselor/therapist, I really want to be able to make a difference in teenagers lives and help them like my therapists helped me get through my struggles in high school.

Hi Vexie

Nice to hear from you too

You always were the cure one round here!

Rob

well, it happened. Kane is now 'only' #2 in the critics poll & #3 in the directors poll.

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=5879&p=119759#p119759

where are you ed?

:'(