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Top 5 'Superhero' Movies 
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Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
Ken wrote:
That's a bold pick.


I suppose so. It's certainly not intended to be bold for boldness's sake.

I dig the movie. I have little exposure and no compelling feelings towards the source material, so I'm not swayed by the changes made in the film.

Truth is, I don't much enjoy superhero films. These five, sure. But I couldn't make a top 10 that I felt good about. And other than the Incredibles, which isn't a traditional superhero flick, none of those do I consider great movies.


Mon Jul 19, 2010 5:50 pm
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
Shade wrote:
I dig the movie. I have little exposure and no compelling feelings towards the source material, so I'm not swayed by the changes made in the film.
It's interesting that your like of the film isn't based on the comics, because neither is my dislike for it. Back in the day, I found the Spawn comics so ludicrous that I could never get into them, so I went into the movie fairly fresh.

It does have a few strong points. Most of them are named Michael Jai White.


Mon Jul 19, 2010 6:07 pm
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
Ken wrote:
It does have a few strong points. Most of them are named Michael Jai White.


Indeed. He carries the film quite well.


Mon Jul 19, 2010 7:10 pm
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
The list that was not meant for teenagers. Sorry, but i can only pick four, because there were only four. I am not going to force a derivative character in this list, because we all know he don't deserve to be included. I am not an avid comic-book follower, but i know cheesy annoying film-making, and Hollywood has a host of these superheros exploding to the fan-boys need. Yes you will cherish these superheros that was part of your childhood, but we are talking movies here, and most of them just don't deserve the cut. I try for five, but there were only four...


Superman (1978) - By far the best superhero movie ever made.
Why - In a genre that is difficult to captivate, Superman stood the test of time, because of the development of it's lead character. Watch Superman today, and you're still amazed by it's grandeur of storytelling, while it stands foot to foot with it's new age counterparts of flashy (Marvel) characters. Richard Donner and Christopher Reeve's best work by a long-shot, knowing that these individuals are quite ordinary performers. John Williams score is pores raising at best, as it defines itself in my movie culture. Although lacking a true villain, this was never a perfect movie, but it sure comes close in this sort of genre. This movie is my favorite, as it stands the test of time.

Batman (1989) - Root for the bad guy.
Why - This was Jack Nicholson show, and he stepped up to the plate. My pick as the best villain in a superhero movie, hard luck to a dead Heath Ledger. Crafty, crazy and hellbent maniacal Nicholson's Joker lived up to it's name, as it gave the fan-boys a different yet decent spin on Batman's arch nemesis. Worth mentioning is Danny Elfman crusading score, it definitely echoed the arrival of the masked vigilante. Dark this movie was, due to the Gothic feel of Tim Burton, in making a druid atmosphere more captivating for Nicholson to run rampant. I don't recognize who Michael Keaton is in this fairytale, but then again i get the same problem with Christian Bale, my flaw in the Batman franchise (they lack a lead actor). To me, a true blockbuster that reawakening the superhero adaptions, too bad alot worst was yet to come.

Batman Begins (2005) - When new Hollywood adapts.
Why - Phenom director Christopher Nolan tries his hand at the fantasy that is superheros. So he took the prior darkness that Burton delivered and add a little brood to it. Clasping a bunch of season actors in the industry, Nolan decided to make a more compact Batman so he can creatively run free in his much herald sequel. Flaw, recognized actors don't really tell into the fantasy of the comic book world, as one needed to get into there character (eg. Nicholson) to be firmly acknowledged. Gary Oldman's Commissioner Gordon is the best performance in this casting, as the others are acceptably tolerable. Write your character a decent and sturdy backdrop, and you let the audience feel this individual, Nolan did this whilst Burton didn't. As Marvel ran rampant, a limited DC was raising the bar for what was yet to come.

The Dark Knight (2008) - Remember, root for the bad guy.
Why - Cause Nolan cast a troubled individual who heightens Nicholson's Joker from maniacal to sadistic. Mind you i prefer Nicholson, but the fantastic Heath Ledger did a performance of his career, as his persona will always be remembered by this character, the same way Reeve's was to Superman. With a scintillating opening that digitally implodes it's quality, The Joker was reborn, and Nolan was revolutionizing the movie world with a villain that will leave a sweet and very sour taste in your mouth. Besides it's high octane opening, this was a nice experience in finesse quality, as Nolan used his technology soundly in creating a beautifully looking movie. The shortcomings is generally singular, there was never enough time (back-story) spent on the prize possession that is Heath Ledger. I don't think i have ever enjoyed a summer movie as much as i enjoyed this. If Nolan continues to embark in the superhero field, then this DC follower will be happy to sit and wait for it's limited but surely creative installments.


Sat Jul 24, 2010 3:29 am
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
Judah wrote:
The list that was not meant for teenagers. Sorry, but i can only pick four, because there were only four. I am not going to force a derivative character in this list, because we all know he don't deserve to be included. I am not an avid comic-book follower, but i know cheesy annoying film-making, and Hollywood has a host of these superheros exploding to the fan-boys need. Yes you will cherish these superheros that was part of your childhood, but we are talking movies here, and most of them just don't deserve the cut. I try for five, but there were only four...



I have no idea what the above paragraph means... :?


Sat Jul 24, 2010 7:14 am
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
5. Batman Begins/Superman (can't decide, two best origin stories ever)
4. Superman Returns (I'm sure I would get a lot of flak for this, but I never understood the hate for this movie. Maybe because I never grew up with the first two? I thought this is the most heartfelt of the superhero genre)
3. Kick Ass (kick-ass indeed)
2. The Incredibles (the most fun and inventive)
1. The Dark Knight (imo the only one that feels epic in this genre. Can't believe a mainstream movie can be this dark.)


Sat Jul 24, 2010 11:15 am
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
Glad this thread got bumped. It reminds me that Ken still owes us two movies. Also: because I can chime in on Batman: Mask of the Phantasm. I only became interested in this one when it was mentioned twice in this thread. Surely some animated Batman movie can't be that good? Well, it is good. Ken mentioned that the creators understood how theatrical movies are made. He's right. The "camera" moves. There are zooms, pans and a few neat edits.

Of course, the story is good too. The film presents a somewhat alternative origin story. Bruce Wayne is still bent on avenging his parents and cleaning up Gotham but unexpectedly finds his rage extinguished by love. If only things worked out differently...

The movie isn't among my "top 5", but it's certainly worth a look. A must see for fans of the Batman.

Judah wrote:
The list that was not meant for teenagers. Sorry, but i can only pick four, because there were only four. I am not going to force a derivative character in this list, because we all know he don't deserve to be included. I am not an avid comic-book follower, but i know cheesy annoying film-making, and Hollywood has a host of these superheros exploding to the fan-boys need. Yes you will cherish these superheros that was part of your childhood, but we are talking movies here, and most of them just don't deserve the cut. I try for five, but there were only four...


You tried for five, got four, but I'm counting two. There's Superman and Batman. No problems there, it just seems that you don't care much for variety.


Sat Jul 24, 2010 11:58 pm
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
ed_metal_head wrote:
Judah wrote:
The list that was not meant for teenagers. Sorry, but i can only pick four, because there were only four. I am not going to force a derivative character in this list, because we all know he don't deserve to be included. I am not an avid comic-book follower, but i know cheesy annoying film-making, and Hollywood has a host of these superheros exploding to the fan-boys need. Yes you will cherish these superheros that was part of your childhood, but we are talking movies here, and most of them just don't deserve the cut. I try for five, but there were only four...


You tried for five, got four, but I'm counting two. There's Superman and Batman. No problems there, it just seems that you don't care much for variety.


Don't pay attention to ed, he receives hand jobs from men. This may possibly be his strategy to receive a hand job from you, Judah. Proceed at your own risk. Or get excited if that's your thing.


Sun Jul 25, 2010 1:51 am
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
PeachyPete wrote:
ed_metal_head wrote:
Judah wrote:
The list that was not meant for teenagers. Sorry, but i can only pick four, because there were only four. I am not going to force a derivative character in this list, because we all know he don't deserve to be included. I am not an avid comic-book follower, but i know cheesy annoying film-making, and Hollywood has a host of these superheros exploding to the fan-boys need. Yes you will cherish these superheros that was part of your childhood, but we are talking movies here, and most of them just don't deserve the cut. I try for five, but there were only four...


You tried for five, got four, but I'm counting two. There's Superman and Batman. No problems there, it just seems that you don't care much for variety.


Don't pay attention to ed, he receives hand jobs from men. This may possibly be his strategy to receive a hand job from you, Judah. Proceed at your own risk. Or get excited if that's your thing.


Don't mind Pete. He knows I was joking about the handjobs. Why would I resort to such things when I have peanut butter. Dogs love to lick peanut butter. You just smear a little on...um, so, superheroes? How bout them?

I always thought Marvel > DC, you?


Mon Jul 26, 2010 12:27 am
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
DC always seemed to naturally have the sense of mythology that Marvel had to struggle for. That said, both companies pump out too high an unconscionable amount of crap to really give either the "attaboy."


Mon Jul 26, 2010 1:32 am
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
ed_metal_head wrote:
Glad this thread got bumped. It reminds me that Ken still owes us two movies. Also: because I can chime in on Batman: Mask of the Phantasm. I only became interested in this one when it was mentioned twice in this thread. Surely some animated Batman movie can't be that good? Well, it is good. Ken mentioned that the creators understood how theatrical movies are made. He's right. The "camera" moves. There are zooms, pans and a few neat edits.

Of course, the story is good too. The film presents a somewhat alternative origin story. Bruce Wayne is still bent on avenging his parents and cleaning up Gotham but unexpectedly finds his rage extinguished by love. If only things worked out differently...

The movie isn't among my "top 5", but it's certainly worth a look. A must see for fans of the Batman.


I absolutely love Batman: The Animated Series. I watched it daily as a teenager, and my girlfriend and I split the cost of the entire 4 seasons a few years ago (each season was on sale for $10, so it was a deal we couldn't pass up). There's great episode after great episode. I can't sing it's praises enough. I've never seen any of the movies based on the series, but Phantasm has always intrigued me. Ken has signed off on it (along with ed and Bones), so I think I'm going to check this one out fairly soon. If it's anywhere near the quality of the show, I'll be very pleased.


Mon Jul 26, 2010 9:19 am
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
PeachyPete wrote:
ed_metal_head wrote:
Glad this thread got bumped. It reminds me that Ken still owes us two movies. Also: because I can chime in on Batman: Mask of the Phantasm. I only became interested in this one when it was mentioned twice in this thread. Surely some animated Batman movie can't be that good? Well, it is good. Ken mentioned that the creators understood how theatrical movies are made. He's right. The "camera" moves. There are zooms, pans and a few neat edits.

Of course, the story is good too. The film presents a somewhat alternative origin story. Bruce Wayne is still bent on avenging his parents and cleaning up Gotham but unexpectedly finds his rage extinguished by love. If only things worked out differently...

The movie isn't among my "top 5", but it's certainly worth a look. A must see for fans of the Batman.


I absolutely love Batman: The Animated Series. I watched it daily as a teenager, and my girlfriend and I split the cost of the entire 4 seasons a few years ago (each season was on sale for $10, so it was a deal we couldn't pass up). There's great episode after great episode. I can't sing it's praises enough. I've never seen any of the movies based on the series, but Phantasm has always intrigued me. Ken has signed off on it (along with ed and Bones), so I think I'm going to check this one out fairly soon. If it's anywhere near the quality of the show, I'll be very pleased.


I don't want to oversell this, but it says on wikipedia that the creators were inspired by Citizen Kane and tried to incorporate the flashbacks in a similar way. It's obviously not as good as Kane, but the statement alone shows that the creators were more ambitious than you'd think.


Mon Jul 26, 2010 2:26 pm
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
I don't want to snorkel their sausages too much, but Bruce Timm and his guys really were doing top-notch work on Batman back in the day. Let's talk about some of the unique things they brought to the table, some of which have had a lasting impact on TV animation ever since.

1. They streamlined their character designs to achieve a high fluidity of animation. Most of the cartoons preceding Batman and even its contemporaries had a fairly dense drawing style, which looked great when it came time to make the action figures and assorted other toys. But it made for shitty animation. With the look that they had, most cartoons couldn't afford a very high frame rate on a TV budget. Timm and Co. not only found an elegant solution to this problem, but came up with a unique visual aesthetic that recalls the animated short films of Fleischer Studios more than it does GI Joe or the '90s Spider-Man.

2. Black paper. These guys loved the shit out of black paper. In Batman, most of the backgrounds were painted on thick black construction paper, which is what gives it that stagy, melodramatic look. Quick: think of some other cartoons of that time period. What did their backgrounds look like? If you can't answer, that's okay. But you probably remember what the backgrounds looked like in Batman. These artists thrived in the dark. In their subsequent work on Superman: the Animated Series, they initially tried going for a sunnier palette, but inevitably went back to nighttime sequences, because it just worked so damn well.

3. These guys were all about the use of visual storytelling, which I briefly touched upon in my Mask of the Phantasm blurb. I think this is the quality that sets them above even the big budget superhero movies of today. When they pitched their vision of Batman to WB, they did so with a demo reel they made of Batman taking down some thugs on a rooftop. One of the significant features of this reel was the sound--or lack of it. They were able to represent a good chunk of the elements that would end up in the show itself without using any sound effects or dialogue. This reel might be floating around on YouTube somewhere, and I know that the show's title sequence was patterned closely upon it.

4. Those title cards that began every episode were so friggin' cool. They're so cool that you might overlook just how important they are. They're the first thing you see after the universal title sequence that opens every show, and they lay the mood on thick from square one. That mood colors everything you see and hear once the narrative gets underway. They look like a Hitchcock movie poster and sound like the eerie, quiet scenes from old monster movies. Eventually, they stopped doing these title cards, and the show lost a little of its magic as a result.

5. They tried to construct their narratives as miniature movies. Most cartoons up to that point had a very basic M.O. They would introduce the bad guy, have a first confrontation in which the bad guy (or his generic minion) wins, and then a second confrontation in which the hero triumphs. Batman was still somewhat bound to this format, but it brings in pathos, complications of character, Pyrrhic victories, and other dramatic devices that brought some additional cinematic sophistication to the usual three act TV structure.

6. They always had a killer lineup of voice talent. The show had a regular cast of top-notch, well-chosen performers, including fan favorite Kevin Conroy as Batman. For one-shot or recurring characters, they often enlisted the talents of known actors in movie or TV. Rather than being mere stunt casting, these actors were cast for the qualities that they would bring to the characters.

7. The episodes are scored by a real orchestra, with music composed and conducted by Shirley Walker. She worked with Danny Elfman on the Batman movie scores, for those who aren't geeky enough to know that sort of thing. It makes a huge difference, just in the level of care that it demonstrates.

8. The writers weren't afraid to shake up established elements of the Batman mythology from the comics. They introduced a handful of original characters and rewrote several existing ones. Many of the changes they made were popular enough with fans and top brass alike that they found their way back into the Batman comics, such as Harley Quinn (original character) and Mr. Freeze (rewritten existing character).

I'm forgetting a ton of things that I wanted to mention, but that's a good start.

And I have a couple marathon shifts ahead of me at work, so I'm sure I'll get those final two blurbs for this thread sorted out at some point.


Mon Jul 26, 2010 6:48 pm
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
Alright, folks. As promised, here are my last two picks. As Madam Web was fond of saying in the 1990s Spider-Man cartoon, "Behold..."

(If that wasn't geeky enough, here's the other version. As Cyclops is fond of saying before unleashing his super movie in the Marvel/Capcom crossover games, "Behold!")


The Incredibles

Come on, like you guys didn't see this one coming a mile away. I'm not even sure how much this bears getting into, because the merits of Pixar and the quality of their movies have been oft-discussed here. Even so, I'll try to find something to talk about.

Funny as it may seem, I think The Incredibles fits right in with the great dystopian superhero epics: Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns. The mood and complexity level might be far different, but their overarching goal is much the same. Rather than spin a conventional superhero yarn, Pixar upends many of the genre conventions that superheroes depend on to maintain their plausibility. What we see in The Incredibles is the chips as they fall.

Actually, by the time The Incredibles came around, deconstructionism in the superhero genre had just about outlived its usefulness. Watchmen and The Dark Knight (and, to a similar extent, Swamp Thing and Marvelman) broke plenty of fresh ground, but also exhausted that freshness in the process. They laid the foundation for a decade or better of superhero stories that forgot what it was like to be optimistic and fun--to really revel in their own superhero-ness.

It's as though an entire generation of storytellers understood that there was a new standard, but had no idea how to meet it. Thus, they resorted to empty imitation. Mimicry without irony. Even the ones that understood why those groundbreaking stories were so good were at a loss to duplicate their success. I might humbly suggest that they were so wrapped up in trying to cleverly twist the superhero that they forgot what made the superhero so beloved in the first place.

The reason The Incredibles works is that it's a completely different permutation of the same qualities that set Watchmen and Dark Knight apart from the pack way back when. We see the same strategies at work. What would happen if superheroes lived in the real world? What if they had to retire and lead bland, ordinary lives? What if extreme circumstances occurred, necessitating that they saddle up for one last ride? The Incredibles succeeds where the post-Alan Moore, post-Frank Miller generation failed. Like jazz musicians, Pixar took the time to learn the tune before trying to riff on it.


Superman Returns

I was hesitant about spending three of my five entries (damn you, rididly strict thread rules!) upon one character, but that's the nature of things. "Best of" does not mean "all-inclusive." Therefore, I had to rule out a number of movies I like, starring characters I like, to whittle things down. It transpires that there are three Superman movies in the top five, one Batman movie, and one movie starring a cast of original characters. So be it.

It's no secret that the public didn't seem to like this movie very much. Fair enough, I say. If people are looking for the definitive Superman--even if they have no idea what that means--they're probably not going to find it here. This is a take on Superman, a special emphasis on a particular set of qualities inherent within the character. That does not mean that it's an invalid or bad take, but it might disappoint the people looking for fistfights and fireworks.

This movie is all about the things that hurt Superman. No, not kryptonite, though there is a little bit of that floating around. It's about yearning for what can't be had, and it's about struggling against the hearts and minds that can't be won. Things that must be understood about a character who, by accident of birth, has the paradoxical responsibility to both be one of us and be something better. If that sounds familiar, it shouldn't be surprising. The filmmakers did thread some Christianity into their portrayal of the character--not the dogma, but the ideals. Fiction often takes the opportunity to explore the secular messiah figure, without the burden of religious mumbo-jumbo.

That all sounds very Serious and Important, but in its heart of hearts, this is still an adventure movie. There's a mischevious, almost Lucifer-esque villain. There's a femme fatale. There are careening vehicles and blazing guns to contend with. There's even a love interest, though this comes in at the far end of the "boy meets girl, boy gets girl, boy loses girl, boy copes without" arc. It's all dramatized in that technicolor, larger-than-life way that reminds us to take simple pleasure in characters who can change the course of mighty rivers. (And, as an added bonus, it isn't dramatized in the whip-pan, ADD way that most action movies are so fond of these days.)

If I had to explain the inclusion of this movie in a "what we've all learned today" kind of way, it's this. These are competent filmmakers putting genuine effort into the filmmaking. They understand that these are classic characters who deserve classical storytelling. They seek to celebrate who the characters are, rather than try to turn them into something they're not. They respect those characters enough to take chances with them, without violating the basic tenets of who they are. And they came up with a special take that, while perhaps not the most essential depiction of Superman, is an interesting and worthwhile one at the very least.

And if the introspective gloom is too much for you, picking up a copy of All Star Superman is a wonderful antidote.


-----

Fun facts:

I considered Unbreakable, Spider-Man, Hulk (Ang Lee version), Batman Begins, Iron Man, and The Dark Knight, but I find their flaws to be too significant to overlook. For example, Iron Man is terrific fun, but in the end, I found that it shared a similar weakness to another RDJ vehicle, Kiss Kiss Bang Bang: once you get away from the tongue-in-cheek action, the peppy dialogue, and the laughs, you find that there's no more movie.

That doesn't mean that I dislike those movies by any means; in fact, I think they're well worth watching and rewatching. I just wouldn't be willing to sign off on them as being TEH BESTEST SUEPRHERO MOVAYS EVAR!!1

Bringing up the hindquarters of my consideration were X-Men, X2, and Spider-Man 2. Again, movies I enjoy, but I can't bring myself to think of them as anything better than good.

Perhaps, if I were permitted to come up with my fantasy vision of a Spider-Man movie, it would include the heroic and romantic arc of the first film, while jettisoning the Green Goblin subplot. In its place, I would import the Dr. Octopus stuff from Spider-Man 2, and I would inject it with some of the dialogue-driven humor of Iron Man. Then, just maybe, we'd have a faithful, highly commendable Spider-Man film.

-----

Just for shits and giggles, I figured I'd list the superhero movies that I have and have not seen, so people know where I'm coming from.

This breakdown is based on the Wikipedia list. Some of the choices in the "haven't seen" section were consciously avoided, and some were simply overlooked due to constraints of time, budget, attention, or whatever. I'm sure some of them are entirely worthy and I just haven't taken the time.

HAVE SEEN

--1950s--
Superman and the Mole Men
--1960s--
Batman (1966)
--1970s--
Superman
--1980s--
Superman II
Superman III
Supergirl
Superman IV: The Quest for Peace
Batman (1989)
--1990s--
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
Darkman
Captain America
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles II: The Secret of the Ooze
The Rocketeer
Batman Returns
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles III
Batman Forever
Mighty Morphin Power Rangers: The Movie
Darkman II: The Return of Durant
Turbo: A Power Rangers Movie
Batman & Robin
Spawn
Blade
--2000s--
X-Men
Unbreakable
Spider-Man
Daredevil
X2: X-Men United
Hulk
Spider-Man 2
Batman Begins
V For Vendetta
X-Men: The Last Stand
Superman II: The Richard Donner Cut
Superman Returns
Ghost Rider
Spider-Man 3
Iron Man
The Incredible Hulk
Hancock
The Dark Knight
The Spirit
X-Men Origins: Wolverine
--2010--
Iron Man 2


HAVEN'T SEEN

--1980s--
The Punisher (1989)
--1990s--
The Fantastic Four (1994)
The Shadow
The Phantom
Darkman III: Die, Darkman, Die
Steel
Mystery Men
--2000s--
The Specials
Blade II
The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen
Hellboy
The Punisher (2004)
Catwoman
Blade Trinity
Elektra
The Fantastic Four (2005)
Sky High
My Super Ex-Girlfriend
Lightspeed
Zoom
The Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer
Underdog
Superhero Movie
Hellboy II: The Golden Army
The Punisher: War Zone
Watchmen
--2010--
Kick-Ass
Jonah Hex


I haven't seen the bulk of the animated features out there, so I might as well just post the ones I have seen.

HAVE SEEN (ANIMATED)

--1990s--
Batman: Mask of the Phantasm
Batman & Mr. Freeze: SubZero
--2000s--
Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker
The Incredibles
Superman: Doomsday
Justice League: The New Frontier
Batman: Gotham Knight


Mon Jul 26, 2010 9:52 pm
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
Ken, I know your not too enthused about the idea of Kick Ass, but I REALLY think you give it a chance once it hits DVD.


Mon Jul 26, 2010 10:11 pm
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
I'm not tremendously opposed to it, but I'm not in a hurry to watch it, either. If it somehow finds its way into my path, I'll check it out.


Mon Jul 26, 2010 11:47 pm
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
Ken wrote:
I'm not tremendously opposed to it, but I'm not in a hurry to watch it, either. If it somehow finds its way into my path, I'll check it out.

Fair enough, and what about The Punisher films?


Tue Jul 27, 2010 1:03 am
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
ed_metal_head wrote:
Glad this thread got bumped. It reminds me that Ken still owes us two movies. Also: because I can chime in on Batman: Mask of the Phantasm. I only became interested in this one when it was mentioned twice in this thread. Surely some animated Batman movie can't be that good? Well, it is good. Ken mentioned that the creators understood how theatrical movies are made. He's right. The "camera" moves. There are zooms, pans and a few neat edits.


This thread inspired me to rewatch Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker last night. I've never seen an episode of Batman Beyond, but the Return of the Joker movie is very good. It's worth streaming on Netflix just to check out. The futuristic next Batman stuff in the first act is a little boring and silly, but the second act is a great flashback to a twisted, dark Joker story. The third act loses a little bit of steam again tying the Joker story into the future, but overall it's a good, fairly dark Batman story--worth checking out as a variation on a theme.

Bonus for being the only Batman movie I've seen to address how irresponsible it is for Bruce Wayne to put children in harm's way as sidekicks. Kevin Smith made the point that, while Robin works in the comics, he wouldn't work in the Nolan movies because in that universe, the sheer recklessness of allowing a teenager to be exposed to what Batman goes through would be... well, pretty evil. Return of the Joker, though, does a really good job of showing how that might work, and the type of guilt and consequences that would necessarily follow Batman when something inevitably goes wrong.


Tue Jul 27, 2010 8:40 am
Post Re: Top 5 'Superhero' Movies
Vexer wrote:
Fair enough, and what about The Punisher films?
I'm not counting on it.

Bones wrote:
This thread inspired me to rewatch Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker last night. I've never seen an episode of Batman Beyond, but the Return of the Joker movie is very good. It's worth streaming on Netflix just to check out. The futuristic next Batman stuff in the first act is a little boring and silly, but the second act is a great flashback to a twisted, dark Joker story. The third act loses a little bit of steam again tying the Joker story into the future, but overall it's a good, fairly dark Batman story--worth checking out as a variation on a theme.
Batman Beyond gets a big thumbs-up from me. It's an excellent alternate take on the Batman legend which, I realize, sounds absolutely ridiculous on paper.

"Hey, kids, do you like Batman?"

"We sure do!"

"Well, how would you like Batman if he were younger?"

"Gee, that would be swell!"

"And hipper?"

"That would be great!"

"And had a flying car?"

"Wow!"

"What if he had a talking dog named Bat-Pup who came from another planet?"

"Uh... can we just have the other stuff?"

"Okay. Hmm. Well, what if he had a mean old boss that he rebels against?"

"Yeah!"

"And what if we put lots of electric guitars in the soundtrack?"

*The children are overstimulated, and are now being put down for a nap.*


Tue Jul 27, 2010 12:41 pm
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