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American Politics 
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Post Re: American Politics
Johnny Larue wrote:
Vexer wrote:
Johnny Larue wrote:
This is why I hate Democrats. They are all so horribly racist.

http://mediatrackers.org/national/2013/ ... -officials

Eh, those didn't really strike me as racist, more like incredibly ridiculous.


That actually explains a lot.... :evil:

How so? :? :evil:

Yes the comments were stupid and ignorant, but a few stupid comments do not necessarily make an individual "racist" by any means. A few dumb comments and owning a resturant and opently admitting to refuse to service to anyone disabled, non-white, gay etc are completely different things.


Tue Feb 11, 2014 6:16 pm
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Post Re: American Politics
You still generalized republicans that way.

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Tue Feb 11, 2014 6:44 pm
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Post Re: American Politics
Gedmud wrote:
You still generalized republicans that way.

I didn't say they were all racist, and I don't think that, but I do think a majority of them are ignorant bigots like that restaurant owner. The major faces of Republicans like Bill O Reilly and Rush Lambaugh have done little to dispell that notion.


Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:16 pm
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Post Re: American Politics
Vexer wrote:
Gedmud wrote:
You still generalized republicans that way.

I didn't say they were all racist, and I don't think that, but I do think a majority of them are ignorant bigots like that restaurant owner. The major faces of Republicans like Bill O Reilly and Rush Lambaugh have done little to dispell that notion.


You do realize what you typed (that I bolded) is a definition of stereotyping, right?


Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:34 pm
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Post Re: American Politics
Vexer wrote:
Yes the comments were stupid and ignorant, but a few stupid comments do not necessarily make an individual "racist" by any means. A few dumb comments and owning a resturant and opently admitting to refuse to service to anyone disabled, non-white, gay etc are completely different things.


Apparently you think that only those who would go so far as to use the word "nigger" should be considered a racist. Either that or you are a blind apologist for your party of choice.


Tue Feb 11, 2014 10:22 pm
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Post Re: American Politics
Johnny Larue wrote:
Vexer wrote:
Yes the comments were stupid and ignorant, but a few stupid comments do not necessarily make an individual "racist" by any means. A few dumb comments and owning a resturant and opently admitting to refuse to service to anyone disabled, non-white, gay etc are completely different things.


Apparently you think that only those who would go so far as to use the word "nigger" should be considered a racist. Either that or you are a blind apologist for your party of choice.

Apparently you don't know me very well at all :roll:

Roastbeef-Funny coming from the guy who got banned for stereotyping Muslims.
Anyways it's not really a stereotype, i'm very hard-pressed to find any Republicans who aren't bigoted in some way, I can count on one-hand the number of Republicans who haven't said something racist, misogynist, sexist, homophobic, etc.


Tue Feb 11, 2014 11:40 pm
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Post Re: American Politics
Vexer wrote:
Apparently you don't know me very well at all :roll:

Roastbeef-Funny coming from the guy who got banned for stereotyping Muslims.
Anyways it's not really a stereotype, i'm very hard-pressed to find any Republicans who aren't bigoted in some way, I can count on one-hand the number of Republicans who haven't said something racist, misogynist, sexist, homophobic, etc.


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Tue Feb 11, 2014 11:52 pm
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Post Re: American Politics
Vexer wrote:
Anyways it's not really a stereotype, i'm very hard-pressed to find any human being who isn't bigoted in some way


There. I fixed that for you. ("in some way" is quite the broad qualifier)
Vexer wrote:
I can count on one-hand the number of Republicans who haven't said something racist, misogynist,sexist, homophobic, etc.

Then you obviously haven't been looking too hard. But then that doesn't surprise me coming from someone who considers the Daily Kos to be the pinnacle of journalistic integrity.


Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:11 am
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Post Re: American Politics
Vexer wrote:
Roastbeef-Funny coming from the guy who got banned for stereotyping Muslims.


I actually clarified and meant "radical muslims"...as terrorists. But yes, I did stereotype nonetheless. At least I can admit it.


Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:27 am
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Post Re: American Politics
Johnny Larue wrote:
Vexer wrote:
Anyways it's not really a stereotype, i'm very hard-pressed to find any human being who isn't bigoted in some way


There. I fixed that for you. ("in some way" is quite the broad qualifier)
Vexer wrote:
I can count on one-hand the number of Republicans who haven't said something racist, misogynist,sexist, homophobic, etc.

Then you obviously haven't been looking too hard. But then that doesn't surprise me coming from someone who considers the Daily Kos to be the pinnacle of journalistic integrity.

What's wrong with Daily Kos? :? They certainly have a hell of a lot more "integrity" then the likes of Faux News.

Perhaps I should look harder though.


Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:29 am
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Post Re: American Politics
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Anyways it's not really a stereotype, i'm very hard-pressed to find any Republicans who aren't bigoted in some way, I can count on one-hand the number of Republicans who haven't said something racist, misogynist, sexist, homophobic, etc.


This is almost word-for-word why I didn't participate in debates at college. The aggressive dumbing down of discourse.

It's actually this kind of quote that permanently pushed me away from left politics

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Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:12 am
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Post Re: American Politics
NotHughGrant wrote:
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Anyways it's not really a stereotype, i'm very hard-pressed to find any Republicans who aren't bigoted in some way, I can count on one-hand the number of Republicans who haven't said something racist, misogynist, sexist, homophobic, etc.


This is almost word-for-word why I didn't participate in debates at college. The aggressive dumbing down of discourse.

It's actually this kind of quote that permanently pushed me away from left politics

Dosen't the UK have a different definition of "left" politics then the U.S.?


Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:41 am
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Post Re: American Politics
No.

Our whole spectrum is to the left of yours, however. The Conservatives here are probably about akin to your Democrats. Whereas The Republicans are to the right of our whole spectrum. And likewise, our Labour Party is further to the left than either of your two parties.

But the terms are basically the same (except Republican here on one level means anti monarchy).

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Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:09 am
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Post Re: American Politics
Our popular perception here is that your monarchs are strictly figureheads. Do they actually do anything? Or is the anti-monarchy thing strictly an issue of not wanting British taxpayer money to subsidize the lifestyle of the royal family?

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Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:18 am
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Post Re: American Politics
Ken wrote:
Our popular perception here is that your monarchs are strictly figureheads. Do they actually do anything? Or is the anti-monarchy thing strictly an issue of not wanting British taxpayer money to subsidize the lifestyle of the royal family?


Yeah that's the top and bottom of it. However, it is often reported that the Royals bring in more money via tourism than they take. Although the exact figures are difficult to quantify. I'm broadly pro-Royal purely for historical reasons. But they do make me cringe somewhat. The Queen's a cracking old bird though.

Technically speaking, not a law in this country can be ratified without the Queen's royal assent. But, she will never, in practice, veto anything.

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Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:26 am
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Post Re: American Politics
Vexer wrote:
What's wrong with Daily Kos?


http://combatblog.net/?p=5704

Vexer wrote:
They certainly have a hell of a lot more "integrity" then the likes of Faux News.


Trust you to bring out the familiar punching bag of Fox News. Here's one difference. Daily Kos rarely, if ever, has any dissenting voices to their political bias. You may argue as to their effectiveness, but Fox regularly has "left leaning" personalities on air to present opposing opinions.


Wed Feb 12, 2014 9:19 am
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Post Re: American Politics
A look at Daily Kos seems to suggest a student type blog, which of course is fine, but shouldn't be regarded as news.

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Wed Feb 12, 2014 9:27 am
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Post Re: American Politics
NotHughGrant wrote:
A look at Daily Kos seems to suggest a student type blog, which of course is fine, but shouldn't be regarded as news.


Exactly. It doesn't pretend to be an objective news source, its a left-leaning but more important to them anti-Republican blog. Nothing wrong with that, but it should not be confused with journalism in any sense.


Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:22 pm
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Post Re: American Politics
NotHughGrant wrote:
Ken wrote:
Our popular perception here is that your monarchs are strictly figureheads. Do they actually do anything? Or is the anti-monarchy thing strictly an issue of not wanting British taxpayer money to subsidize the lifestyle of the royal family?


Yeah that's the top and bottom of it. However, it is often reported that the Royals bring in more money via tourism than they take. Although the exact figures are difficult to quantify. I'm broadly pro-Royal purely for historical reasons. But they do make me cringe somewhat. The Queen's a cracking old bird though.

Technically speaking, not a law in this country can be ratified without the Queen's royal assent. But, she will never, in practice, veto anything.


Sorry for jumping in, but although I'm not British, I've lived and studied there for a while, including a bit of constitutional law. So I hope NotHughGrant will forgive me if I expand a bit on his statement. I think the monarchy in Britain makes it fundamentally different from other democratic countries. The sovereign in the UK is not the people, but the King or Queen (or rather, the King or Queen in Parliament) and this is partially reflected in British attitudes. For one, Britain has never overcome her class system. You can be as rich, well educated and popular as you like, but you'll never be considered Upper Class unless you hold a hereditary title. The second chamber of the British Parliament, the House of Lords, is partially constituted of hereditary peers, which would be unthinkable in nations like the U.S., France or Germany. (This has some minor political relevance, too. Remember the controversy on the ban on fox-hunting, to which the House of Lords objected at first?). Further, there is no written constitution and, consequently, there is no catalogue of human rights and civil rights which could limit the power of the legislature. The Human Rights Act 1998 (and the Magna Charta, of course) has created a bit of human rights protection, but, technically speaking, this Act could be revoked. In contrast, similar to the U.S. Supreme Court, the German Constututional Court can (and does) annul legislation if it is deemed not to conform to the constitution, for instance by violating constitutional human rights.

It is true that, in practice, the Queen does not exert much influence on politics, although she is the head of state, and that she's more of a symbol. Apart from a minority, who are republicans by conviction, many Britons question whether her limited role justifies the relatively high expense for subsidising the royal family, who, let's not forget, are actually filthy rich. From my personal experience, I would also suggest that the Queen is less accepted in Scotland than in England. I know many Scots and all but a few are against the monarchy, and most of these republicans don't even support Scottish independence.

NotHughGrant wrote:
No.

Our whole spectrum is to the left of yours, however. The Conservatives here are probably about akin to your Democrats. Whereas The Republicans are to the right of our whole spectrum. And likewise, our Labour Party is further to the left than either of your two parties.

But the terms are basically the same (except Republican here on one level means anti monarchy).


I think that it is problematic to compare the political spectrum of two countries by using the same terminology. For example, wouldn't support for the private ownership of firearms be considered a conservative viewpoint in the U.S.? I think the Tories would strongly oppose this. Likewise, I cannot imagine a U.S. Republican supporting the monarchy as an institution. And the term "liberal" is used entirely differently in Europe as well and would refer to politics in the tradition of 19th century liberalism, such as the German Free Democrats or the British Liberal Party.

I don't think that the terms "left" or "right" have much political meaning, unless you define these terms further by identifying the political aims of both groups. I think that these will very much depend on the political environment, which is quite different in all countries.


Wed Feb 12, 2014 1:15 pm
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Post Re: American Politics
Ken wrote:
I about died laughing when I saw the Reuters report that detailed, among other shit you just can't make up, how the Pentagon has squandered billions of dollars since the late '90s on unproductive internal programs to track and eliminate waste in their budget. I repeat: they managed to waste money trying to figure out how to save money.

You have to give them credit, though. They're creating plenty of jobs in the satire business.


Then you have the clusterfuck that is the VA, for which Jon Stewart must secretly be thankful. He's mined that topic numerous times.


Wed Feb 12, 2014 1:36 pm
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