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I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But... 
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
"Wow, I went from feeling confident in the midst of losses that the Spurs still had a fighting chance against the Lakers, now after seeing this team play the last week, I'm very discouraged. This is the time of the year that you're starting to play your best basketball headed into the playoffs. In my fourteen years as a Spurs fan, this is not the usual second half of the season charge I'm used to, it looks more like an old man on his way to dying. This saddens me too, it's been a great era for this team, four championships, great players, great coach, overall great luck. Now it looks like they'll be lucky to (I hate you Evenflow) get out of the first round at this point. I'm frankly stunned, a loss to the Cavs is acceptable, but by 20 points when your at full-strength (although there are rumors circulating that TD has bum knees, reason why he missed quite a few games the second half of the season), I don't find that acceptable. Oh well, as said, it's been a great era, and it sucks having to look at the fact that this team is done, they surely look like a beaten old man right now. I knew we should've traded for Vince Carter, stupid economy....

Couldn't blame me at the time though, usually the Spurs go into the playoffs looking mighty strong. Now they look very fragile and not able to hit a thing (why Pop is continuing to play a one-dimensional player like Micheal Finley instead of starting Bruce Bowen or developing Malik Hairston, I'll never know. Roger Mason has also gone sour cold this second half of the season). I was confident when at full-strength they would be able to make a charge and look strong going into the playoffs, for once in the last decade or so, that doesn't look to be the case."

Didn't edit a thing.

Oh, and I posted rankings, all the while never actually saying that the Spurs would finish #5. When I posted that, they were simply at the number 5 slot. As for which is closer - just ask how many games they would have to lose to fall to 5 and how many they would need to win to get back to number two, so that point doesn't ring true, either.


Thu Apr 16, 2009 9:05 pm
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Evenflow8112 wrote:
"Wow, I went from feeling confident in the midst of losses that the Spurs still had a fighting chance against the Lakers, now after seeing this team play the last week, I'm very discouraged. This is the time of the year that you're starting to play your best basketball headed into the playoffs. In my fourteen years as a Spurs fan, this is not the usual second half of the season charge I'm used to, it looks more like an old man on his way to dying. This saddens me too, it's been a great era for this team, four championships, great players, great coach, overall great luck. Now it looks like they'll be lucky to (I hate you Evenflow) get out of the first round at this point. I'm frankly stunned, a loss to the Cavs is acceptable, but by 20 points when your at full-strength (although there are rumors circulating that TD has bum knees, reason why he missed quite a few games the second half of the season), I don't find that acceptable. Oh well, as said, it's been a great era, and it sucks having to look at the fact that this team is done, they surely look like a beaten old man right now. I knew we should've traded for Vince Carter, stupid economy....

Couldn't blame me at the time though, usually the Spurs go into the playoffs looking mighty strong. Now they look very fragile and not able to hit a thing (why Pop is continuing to play a one-dimensional player like Micheal Finley instead of starting Bruce Bowen or developing Malik Hairston, I'll never know. Roger Mason has also gone sour cold this second half of the season). I was confident when at full-strength they would be able to make a charge and look strong going into the playoffs, for once in the last decade or so, that doesn't look to be the case."

Didn't edit a thing.

Oh, and I posted rankings, all the while never actually saying that the Spurs would finish #5. When I posted that, they were simply at the number 5 slot. As for which is closer - just ask how many games they would have to lose to fall to 5 and how many they would need to win to get back to number two, so that point doesn't ring true, either.


Ah, can't argue the truth so you go back to earlier posts that still prove nothing. Just like you said the Mavs weren't looking great a few weeks ago, now you think they're looking great. I said the Spurs weren't looking great then and the way they were playing, it looked bad, but now they've picked it up. Again, your argument, or trying to twist my words around again, ultimately fails yet again. I would say I wasn't expecting this, but I was.

It happens, fans get down on their teams. Then again, I guess you wouldn't know this since you claim to be a fan of no one, yet your Boston Celtics love is blurring your "logic", as you say.

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Thu Apr 16, 2009 9:42 pm
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
I didn't accuse you of being a bandwagoner (which is, for the record, a dumb word); I accused you of being inconsistent, and unreasonable in your approach to the argument. The Spurs lose to the Thunder, and you undergo panic. They beat the Thunder a week later, you say nary a word. You argue a point with me ceaselessly, then over a bad two week stretch, use my exact words.

Because you happened to miss my beef with Stein earlier, I didn't expect Stein, or anyone else, to put the Celtics at number 1. The Cavs, however, have deserved it more than the Lakers, and Stein has been reluctant to do put them at uno slot, no matter how silly it has been to keep them on top on certain weeks. The number one team on his list won't host the Finals if they face the Cavs. Biased crap.

P.S. - What is this 'fan' fixation you have? Did Tim Duncan save your dog from a burning building? There are people who do not have 'favorite' teams. In fact, I'd say anyone who would stay a Spurs fan after Duncan leaves is confused; I go for the players. I think it would be great if Boston won, because they have a great core of players who deserve their successes. I would like it if Cleveland won, because then LeBron could begin his mythology. I would hate it if the Lakers won, because I think Kobe represents less of the team mentality that his other MVP company has, and people I think would attribute this season to him alone (in reference to his Shaq era), when the Lakers would be royally puffed without Pau Gasol's contribution. I wanted to see Steve Nash win a championship. Hell, I think Dirk deserves another shot, even if he ruined the last one.


Fri Apr 17, 2009 1:32 am
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Evenflow8112 wrote:
I didn't accuse you of being a bandwagoner (which is, for the record, a dumb word); I accused you of being inconsistent, and unreasonable in your approach to the argument. The Spurs lose to the Thunder, and you undergo panic. They beat the Thunder a week later, you say nary a word. You argue a point with me ceaselessly, then over a bad two week stretch, use my exact words.

Because you happened to miss my beef with Stein earlier, I didn't expect Stein, or anyone else, to put the Celtics at number 1. The Cavs, however, have deserved it more than the Lakers, and Stein has been reluctant to do put them at uno slot, no matter how silly it has been to keep them on top on certain weeks. The number one team on his list won't host the Finals if they face the Cavs. Biased crap.

P.S. - What is this 'fan' fixation you have? Did Tim Duncan save your dog from a burning building? There are people who do not have 'favorite' teams. In fact, I'd say anyone who would stay a Spurs fan after Duncan leaves is confused; I go for the players. I think it would be great if Boston won, because they have a great core of players who deserve their successes. I would like it if Cleveland won, because then LeBron could begin his mythology. I would hate it if the Lakers won, because I think Kobe represents less of the team mentality that his other MVP company has, and people I think would attribute this season to him alone (in reference to his Shaq era), when the Lakers would be royally puffed without Pau Gasol's contribution. I wanted to see Steve Nash win a championship. Hell, I think Dirk deserves another shot, even if he ruined the last one.


Your argument as far as rooting for teams is literally the dumbest thing I've heard when it comes to this game. So your calling basically anyone whose a fan of their team an idiot when the best player retires or leaves? Do you hear yourself when you talk? I actually feel bad for you. Your trying to act all objective, which is hilarious considering you've already said you would be a Nets fan if they didn't suck, so your "like" Boston, although it looks like right now at least your a fan of them, so your not completely objective, hence all your dumb arguments like "The Cavs lost their last home game! This will hurt!". I'm a Spurs fan to the end, when Duncan retires, it'll probably get ugly for a few years, but unlike you I'm loyal to a team. No, Tim Duncan didn't do anything for me (another stupid statement), that's not the point. Fans pick their favorite teams for varied reasons. Most of those fans remain loyal to that team just because that's all they know. Something you haven't (and never apparently) will grasp.

You make it sounds like the Celtics are a group of great guys that deserve another title just because their easy to root for. Really? They're great players, but they're not upstanding citizens of the league. Kevin Garnett drops more "f" bombs on the court than anyone else I know, just watch his lips after a dunk. He's notorious for being the league's worst trash talker, and his speech after the Celtics won the title bordered on comical when he couldn't be professional enough to conduct an interview with ABC, screaming and wailing away. Ray Allen is one of the biggest cryers in the game. It's never his fault, it's always the refs, his teammates, or the coaches. Paul Pierce is the only one out of the big three who has some class to him, although I've had my beefs with him as well.

Bottom line, you don't like the Spurs for some reason, probably out of jealousy because they knocked the Nets out in 2003 and have won the title three times this decade. You say they're not a contender even with Ginobili, only someone whose blocking historical facts would say that. Stop trying to act objective about all of this, your a Celtics fan (for now at least).

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Fri Apr 17, 2009 11:49 am
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Sorry for jumping in between evenflow and dunkin dan, but I just wanted to throw my 2 cents in concerning Marc Stein ranking the Lakers above the Cavs. For the record, I am a unabashed hater of the Lakers. Can't stand em. However, I don't think it's silly of Stein to say the Lakers are better than the Cavs. Their records are basically identical (one game difference). The Lakers beat the Cavs twice during the season including the Cavs first home loss. Many "experts" say the Lakers should be the favorite to win it all, not just Marc Stein.

That is all. Thank you for keeping me entertained in this spirited thread. Continue arguing.


Fri Apr 17, 2009 2:19 pm
Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
'Your trying to act all objective, which is hilarious considering you've already said you would be a Nets fan if they didn't suck, so your "like" Boston, although it looks like right now at least your a fan of them, so your not completely objective, hence all your dumb arguments like "The Cavs lost their last home game! This will hurt!".'

Ok, this is ridiculous, Dan. You're* How many times can you misspell that in one post?

Despite all of your unfounded mudslinging, I am objective, and so far, much of what I have said before has happened. I said the Cavs should be considered number one right just a few posts ago, therefore I did not say the Celtics shoudl be considered #1 without Garnett. I am aware of the reality of the league. I simply have an opinion on it that differs from yours. You say it's because the Spurs beat the Nets in 03'. Dude, you are neither intimidating or challenging me with this; you're basically recycling the same old insults from last week and last month.

'Your argument as far as rooting for teams is literally the dumbest thing I've heard when it comes to this game. So your calling basically anyone whose a fan of their team an idiot when the best player retires or leaves? Do you hear yourself when you talk? I actually feel bad for you.'

What is a house, but for the people inside of it? What is a team, but a group of players, some you care for, some you don't. This isn't 'dumb', it simply challenges your more traditional idea of fanhood. The world exists outside of the NBA, and I don't play by any set of rules regarding how to feel about it, because there is no point to it. I feel bad for you. You have all these rules, and you think they'll save you :ugeek:

'You make it sounds like the Celtics are a group of great guys that deserve another title just because their easy to root for. Really? They're great players, but they're not upstanding citizens of the league.'

I don't care if any of the Boston Celtics would help an old lady across the street. They are a TEAM, through and through. Depth, hard work, consistent effort. They are proof of the idea that a bunch of superstars can make a team great, instead of pick each other apart with egos and gripes. Whether or not Kevin Garnett curses, well, I'm sorry it bothers you so much. I don't think it matters worth a damn.

When Duncan leaves, I'll gauge your comments. Apparently, all it took was a loss to a sub-.500 team and a cold end to a season to shake your 'faith' in the team. I'm not confident in your logic's consistency. Sorry. That's what happens when you fall back on your words.


Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:13 pm
Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Evenflow8112 wrote:
Ok, this is rididulous, Dan. You're* How many times can you mispell that in one post?


Well, it only took you two sentences to misspell two words, so how about we stay away from this worthlessness. Couldn't you two get the insults in via PM? Any chance we could stick with topics relevant to basketball?

Being a "fan" of a player or team does not make anyone objective any more or less than not being a fan does. No one is free of bias, some just have it a bit more than others (or maybe they just can't control it). Regardless, it's perfectly logical for someone to be of the opinion that the Lakers are the favorites right now. That said, Stein is a joke, for reasons far beyond his power rankings (one of which is the fact that he just doesn't like basketball that much, not to mention he's an awful writer).

That said, I do think it's pretty ridiculous that Dunkin Dan needs to rip on KG for swearing (with an Eddie Norton avatar, no less!) Do some research: KG has built over 50 homes in New Orleans post-Katrina. 100% funded them. He visits children's hospitals several times during the year, only he doesn't let "NBA Cares" film it. He raised his sister while becoming a high school star and NBA player. He's never been in trouble with the law, keeps his wife and child away from the spotlight, and there has never been a more loyal or hardworking player in any sport.

DunkinDan89 wrote:
his speech after the Celtics won the title bordered on comical when he couldn't be professional enough to conduct an interview with ABC, screaming and wailing away.


I'm pretty sure he doesn't work for ABC. You want him to turn off his emotions? Love it or hate it, there has never been a more heartfelt post-game interview. So to you, the guy having emotions and wearing them honestly makes him a bad guy?

DunkinDan89 wrote:
Ray Allen is one of the biggest cryers in the game. It's never his fault, it's always the refs, his teammates, or the coaches.


First of all, your boy Timmy Duncan is, without question, the biggest whiner in the game. I don't think he believes he's ever actually committed a foul.

Also, can provide a single example of Ray Allen saying anything blaming his coach or his teammates? Sorry, but I'm not going to let you just throw that out there when there's no example of it. Again, you certainly don't have to like the guy, but don't slander him.


Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:33 pm
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Evenflow8112 wrote:
'Your trying to act all objective, which is hilarious considering you've already said you would be a Nets fan if they didn't suck, so your "like" Boston, although it looks like right now at least your a fan of them, so your not completely objective, hence all your dumb arguments like "The Cavs lost their last home game! This will hurt!".'

Ok, this is ridiculous, Dan. You're* How many times can you misspell that in one post?

Despite all of your unfounded mudslinging, I am objective, and so far, much of what I have said before has happened. I said the Cavs should be considered number one right just a few posts ago, therefore I did not say the Celtics shoudl be considered #1 without Garnett. I am aware of the reality of the league. I simply have an opinion on it that differs from yours. You say it's because the Spurs beat the Nets in 03'. Dude, you are neither intimidating or challenging me with this; you're basically recycling the same old insults from last week and last month.

'Your argument as far as rooting for teams is literally the dumbest thing I've heard when it comes to this game. So your calling basically anyone whose a fan of their team an idiot when the best player retires or leaves? Do you hear yourself when you talk? I actually feel bad for you.'

What is a house, but for the people inside of it? What is a team, but a group of players, some you care for, some you don't. This isn't 'dumb', it simply challenges your more traditional idea of fanhood. The world exists outside of the NBA, and I don't play by any set of rules regarding how to feel about it, because there is no point to it. I feel bad for you. You have all these rules, and you think they'll save you :ugeek:

'You make it sounds like the Celtics are a group of great guys that deserve another title just because their easy to root for. Really? They're great players, but they're not upstanding citizens of the league.'

I don't care if any of the Boston Celtics would help an old lady across the street. They are a TEAM, through and through. Depth, hard work, consistent effort. They are proof of the idea that a bunch of superstars can make a team great, instead of pick each other apart with egos and gripes. Whether or not Kevin Garnett curses, well, I'm sorry it bothers you so much. I don't think it matters worth a damn.

When Duncan leaves, I'll gauge your comments. Apparently, all it took was a loss to a sub-.500 team and a cold end to a season to shake your 'faith' in the team. I'm not confident in your logic's consistency. Sorry. That's what happens when you fall back on your words.


Lol, funny you spelled ridiculous the first time around, irony. It's a freaking forum, I didn't know it was a spelling bee. I think KG's tough-guy act has gotten old and he needs to get over himself. He tries to act like such a thug on the court but whenever he actually gets in the thick of it he doesn't do anything (see Zaza Pachulia in last year's playoffs). I respect players that play the game and keep their mouths shut and trash talking limited, KG does this excessively.

As far as Allen, I'm pretty sure if my memory serves me correctly, he had more than one beef with Karl, the most memorable one being that he blamed him for trading him to Seattle instead of just manning up and saying "this is a new start" or being just a little professional, its coaches fault I'm here now. The teammates thing, you got me there, I thought I remembered him calling out teammates, but I guess thats more Kobe Bryant like than anything. The point I was making is that it's never his fault. In one of the games between the Spurs and Celtics, he threw away a pass right into Ginobili's hands because he couldn't inbound the ball. Instead of him saying "my bad, I threw a bad pass", he went right away blaming the refs that they didn't give him enough room. He cries constantly whenever he gets shut down by an opposing defender. You talk about whiners? He's certainly up there.

When did I ever say Tim Duncan doesn't whine? To call him the biggest whiner is a massive exaggeration however. That belongs to Kobe Bryant by far.

Evenflow, you aren't objective, lol. No harm in saying that your a Celtics fan, I'm just getting annoyed your trying to act all objective when its clear as anything your a fan of the Celtics. You presented another clue when you said that a home loss to the Sixers when the Cavs were without 4/5 of their starting line-up would "come back to haunt them". Teams do this all the time at the end of the season, the Spurs did this during their championship years, didn't hurt them.

You talk about falling back on your words, you've done that more than enough already, now your trying to turn it on me. I said without Ginobili they aren't looking like they'll win a championship. I said the way they were playing at that time, it was going to be tough in the first round. It still is, all I'm saying is they're playing better recently. Your Spurs hate however blocks you from using the "logic" you so claim to have, this also applies to your Celtics love however. See, I'm biased, I admitted that like in my first post or whatever, its just annoying me you're trying to be all objective, when you're clearly not.

If your questioning my loyalty to my team, I've been a fan of them for fourteen years. I stuck with them when Robinson went down with his injury and they got lucky and drafted Duncan. So again, you argument is a crappy one.

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Last edited by DunkinDan89 on Fri Apr 17, 2009 11:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Fri Apr 17, 2009 10:05 pm
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
'You presented another clue when you said that a home loss to the Sixers when the Cavs were without 4/5 of their starting line-up would "come back to haunt them". Teams do this all the time at the end of the season, the Spurs did this during their championship years, didn't hurt them.'

You might have a point at some other time during this statement in that the Cavs might not, in fact, suffer from the game. It's up in the air.... as is the nature of opinions. It's sure as hell possible to differ, but you cannot state, for a fact, that I am wrong.

I continue to be at a loss at how my statement would be changed/baised by my preference for the Celtics. Just because you can't grasp what I am proposing isn't similar to me being biased. There is no 'clue' here, nor was I stating anything other than my literal text. I didn't even mention the Celtics. You're just being lazy and running away with associations.

'Your Spurs hate however blocks you from using the "logic" you so claim to have, this also applies to your Celtics love however.'

I won't respond to this part of your argument, until you offer me a quote where I state that I hate the Spurs. Find it. Otherwise, your argument has no validity. If you're going to note that all of my posts have been Spurs-related since the last, well, 10 or so pages, well, who am I talking but David Robinson's illegitimate child.


P.S. - I'm not only questioning your loyalty, but I am nearly mocking it. To me, you're reading from some invisible book you forced into existance. You need to subscribe to an ideal in order to betray it, and we read two very different magazines.


Fri Apr 17, 2009 10:54 pm
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Evenflow8112 wrote:
'You presented another clue when you said that a home loss to the Sixers when the Cavs were without 4/5 of their starting line-up would "come back to haunt them". Teams do this all the time at the end of the season, the Spurs did this during their championship years, didn't hurt them.'

You might have a point at some other time during this statement in that the Cavs might not, in fact, suffer from the game. It's up in the air.... as is the nature of opinions. It's sure as hell possible to differ, but you cannot state, for a fact, that I am wrong.

I continue to be at a loss at how my statement would be changed/baised by my preference for the Celtics. Just because you can't grasp what I am proposing isn't similar to me being biased. There is no 'clue' here, nor was I stating anything other than my literal text. I didn't even mention the Celtics. You're just being lazy and running away with associations.

'Your Spurs hate however blocks you from using the "logic" you so claim to have, this also applies to your Celtics love however.'

I won't respond to this part of your argument, until you offer me a quote where I state that I hate the Spurs. Find it. Otherwise, your argument has no validity. If you're going to note that all of my posts have been Spurs-related since the last, well, 10 or so pages, well, who am I talking but David Robinson's illegitimate child.


P.S. - I'm not only questioning your loyalty, but I am nearly mocking it. To me, you're reading from some invisible book you forced into existance. You need to subscribe to an ideal in order to betray it, and we read two very different magazines.


Ah, there you go, playing your favorite play, wordplay :). Let's not get into that though, that's a game I'm tired of playing with you. Bottom line: Don't question my loyalty to my team. As said, I've been a fan of them ever since I was five. You've said before that in a perfect world you would be a Nets fan, but since they're not that good, you "like" for the Celtics. So take a long, hard look at yourself there. Are you saying fans can't get upset over losses? No ones perfect, and I don't retract my previous statements that by the way they were playing, it looked doubtful they were going to get out of the first round. You see it as a form of "questioning loyalty", I see it as a form of demanding more from your team when you know they're capable of more. Since then, the Spurs have played very well, and I'm glad they looks more assertive and confident out on the court. You continue to think your very objective here, I guess whatever makes you feel better. From your comments, you've made it sound that anyone outside of the Lakers doesn't have a shot of touching the greatness that is the Celtics (even without KG!). This is alarming, but be it as it may.

Its funny you have never responded to some of my previous arguments, you just pass it off because you probably know that you don't have a great counter. You label them as "recycled" and old, but to me it just sounds like a desperate way of escape because you don't have anything to come back with.

I'm a Spurs fan, your a "whoever's hot right now" fan, so I guess we'll leave it at that.

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Fri Apr 17, 2009 11:35 pm
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
DunkinDan89 wrote:
I think KG's tough-guy act has gotten old and he needs to get over himself. He tries to act like such a thug on the court but whenever he actually gets in the thick of it he doesn't do anything (see Zaza Pachulia in last year's playoffs). I respect players that play the game and keep their mouths shut and trash talking limited, KG does this excessively.


But now you are the one shifting your words a bit...you said he's not an "upstanding citizen"...apparently to do so he should get in more fights? Have you ever considered that maybe he's the smart one by never overreacting or getting tossed from games or throwing punches? KG is one of the cleanest players in the game. Yes, he talks a lot. But no one in the league right now is more widely respected by his peers. No player has anything bad to say about KG.

DunkinDan89 wrote:
When did I ever say Tim Duncan doesn't whine? To call him the biggest whiner is a massive exaggeration however. That belongs to Kobe Bryant by far.


I know you don't like Kobe, but gotta disagree here pretty hard man. Kobe whines, yes, but there are fifty worse whiners in the league right now. Unlike everyone else except 'Bron and DWade, Kobe doesn't need to whine because he gets every call he wants.

Evenflow8112 wrote:
I'm not only questioning your loyalty, but I am nearly mocking it. To me, you're reading from some invisible book you forced into existance. You need to subscribe to an ideal in order to betray it, and we read two very different magazines.


Yes, but the point is, you are both reading magazines. If an invisible book is what forces Dan to be loyal, it's simply a different invisible book that fuels your ability to swing your fandom, to hate Kobe & LA, etc.

And really, both of you have stopped actually responding to basketball arguments, so how about we move on? Any fearless first round predictions?


Sat Apr 18, 2009 12:20 am
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Shade wrote:
DunkinDan89 wrote:
I think KG's tough-guy act has gotten old and he needs to get over himself. He tries to act like such a thug on the court but whenever he actually gets in the thick of it he doesn't do anything (see Zaza Pachulia in last year's playoffs). I respect players that play the game and keep their mouths shut and trash talking limited, KG does this excessively.


But now you are the one shifting your words a bit...you said he's not an "upstanding citizen"...apparently to do so he should get in more fights? Have you ever considered that maybe he's the smart one by never overreacting or getting tossed from games or throwing punches? KG is one of the cleanest players in the game. Yes, he talks a lot. But no one in the league right now is more widely respected by his peers. No player has anything bad to say about KG.

DunkinDan89 wrote:
When did I ever say Tim Duncan doesn't whine? To call him the biggest whiner is a massive exaggeration however. That belongs to Kobe Bryant by far.


I know you don't like Kobe, but gotta disagree here pretty hard man. Kobe whines, yes, but there are fifty worse whiners in the league right now. Unlike everyone else except 'Bron and DWade, Kobe doesn't need to whine because he gets every call he wants.

Evenflow8112 wrote:
I'm not only questioning your loyalty, but I am nearly mocking it. To me, you're reading from some invisible book you forced into existance. You need to subscribe to an ideal in order to betray it, and we read two very different magazines.


Yes, but the point is, you are both reading magazines. If an invisible book is what forces Dan to be loyal, it's simply a different invisible book that fuels your ability to swing your fandom, to hate Kobe & LA, etc.

And really, both of you have stopped actually responding to basketball arguments, so how about we move on? Any fearless first round predictions?


Yeah I guess I got a little carried away as far as the KG stuff, haha, I just don't like the kind of player he is on the court, he just seems like a thug.

I don't think Duncan whines that much, then again, I'm biased. He has his wide-eye expression, but there have been more than a few times where he raises his arm up after committing a foul, acknowledging he did it. Again, I'm biased, I don't think he get enough respect in the post. He constantly gets destroyed when going up for a layup and that's when he gets heated. See what I mean when Dampier is guarding him this series, Damp especially has a habit for drawing more arm than ball and getting away with it. See how Duncan gets treated as opposed to how Dirk the actor gets treated (anytime he screams, I call it the "Pau Gasol treatment", anytime a soft big man screams, he gets a call, just listen).

Your dead on about Kobe. He does get a ton of calls. I've lost count on how many times a hand in the face is a foul when it comes to Kobe, or if you breathe on him to heavily, that's also a foul. He gets an insane amount of treatment, probably a reason why its shaped him into the pampered, troubled, and hypocritical brat that he is.

I still say Spurs in 7, if Drew Gooden is consistent and the Spurs defense shows up.

My "fearless" postseason prediction is New Orleans over Denver in 7. I just don't think Denver is that potent of a threat as a 2 seed, they have to be the weakest (maybe "underrated" to some) #2 seed in years. I think with New Orleans shaping up, David West's mid-range shot hitting net almost everytime he shoots it up, and CP3 dribbling (and flopping) his way around the court, the Hornets have a shot at the upset here.

In the East, I also follow Philly, I'll be rooting for them as well. If Orlando doesn't hit their 3's, Philly's got a shot, I think if Dalembert stays out of foul trouble, he's a tough matchup for anyone in the post (as far as Dwight Howard goes). But that's a big "if" I'm relying on.

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Sat Apr 18, 2009 1:16 am
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Alright, I'm going to be frank on this one; if you buy any series based on seeding in the West BESIDES L.A., you are seriously naive. Glad to see nobody here is. New Orleans being #7 to me isn't a big putoff for me with them; they are a genuinely talented team with the best PG this game has to offer. I see them over the Nuggets, in possibly 6, likely 7. I want to see if Billups gives them some extra playoff edge, as stated before, but even if they have improved, New Orleans is a serious team that handle adversity about as well as anybody. I personally look forward to seeing how this plays out, and if Denver does do some early rolling, I'm at least more curious as to how bady they can challenge L.A., even if I still think the Lakers are realistically untouchable out West.

Portland and Houston I think will be one or the other dominating. It isn't a case of 4 against 5 to me; it's a case of two teams that strike me as unpredictable. I could see either taking the series in 5 or 6 games, because I just feel that's how this series will roll. Not looking forward to it, really.

Out East, I do not see anybody running the table and making the top three look scared. The only wildcard is how Orlando pulls off it's three in the playoffs; if they can do it alot, we're not only looking at a four-to-five game first series, but some serious push for the big 'O'. If they fizzle there, I see the Sixers making some more trouble, but I don't visualize them winning it. Not at all.

On my more personal feelings - Hopefully, KG does make a later return to the playoffs (UNLESS he comes back late playoffs, which I don't count as crazy just yet). Boston will make quick work of their first series, though. I don't see an uspet in the making. I'm still not sold on Orlando beating them in a seven game series by default, either. The longer they make it, the longer KG gets to grease the wheels. I hope.


Sat Apr 18, 2009 1:04 pm
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Quick work eh?

HOW BOUT DEM BULLS!!!!

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Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:40 pm
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Dallas, you big, beautiful team. But seriously, when did these guys start playing for keeps? Like, what date?

Houston murdered Portland. I think my prophecy may yet come true.

Cleveland is, while not my favorite team in the land, looking like better every game. This was a big display from James. I, again, wouldn't mind seeing him with a ring to go along with his MVP trophy. He's a phenom.

Boston... meh. No indication of the series, really, but discouraging nonetheless. They can beat the Bulls sans KG, and should.


Sun Apr 19, 2009 1:27 am
Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Evenflow8112 wrote:
Boston... meh. No indication of the series, really, but discouraging nonetheless. They can beat the Bulls sans KG, and should.


Boston losing Game 1 of the playoffs is no indication of the series??? Would it be fair to say its no indication of the C's rest of the playoffs too? A team that truly relied on home court last year in the playoffs??? Fine, I will give the defending champs (albeit one without arguably its biggest cog) the benefit of the doubt and accept the cliche that they have the intangibles and "know how" to win. Fine, fine. Yet them losing home court advantage, in a game they let a rookie essentially beat them, is no big deal, but the Cavs losing a final regular season game is? The Cavs were basically giving that game away since they started the first 5 fans with courtside seats. That loss will come back to haunt them, but this one is not major for the Celtics? Interesting analysis....


Sun Apr 19, 2009 3:13 am
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
jkberden wrote:
Evenflow8112 wrote:
Boston... meh. No indication of the series, really, but discouraging nonetheless. They can beat the Bulls sans KG, and should.


Boston losing Game 1 of the playoffs is no indication of the series??? Would it be fair to say its no indication of the C's rest of the playoffs too? A team that truly relied on home court last year in the playoffs??? Fine, I will give the defending champs (albeit one without arguably its biggest cog) the benefit of the doubt and accept the cliche that they have the intangibles and "know how" to win. Fine, fine. Yet them losing home court advantage, in a game they let a rookie essentially beat them, is no big deal, but the Cavs losing a final regular season game is? The Cavs were basically giving that game away since they started the first 5 fans with courtside seats. That loss will come back to haunt them, but this one is not major for the Celtics? Interesting analysis....


It's called "denial". See, he's a Celtics fan, he just won't admit it. Yes, apparently the Cavs losing their last regular season game without 4/5 of their starting lineup "will come back to bite them", but the Celtics losing Game 1 against a very young and unproven (and also undermanned, no Luol Deng) Bulls team? Meh...

I'm not to worried about the Spurs. They lost Game 1 of the first round in 03, 05, and 07, and they turned out alright. Plus, the Mavs role players couldn't miss, I don't expect that to continue. Erick Dampier can apparently bludgeon Tim Duncan in the post and get away with it, but Barea can act like he got shot out of a cannon on "defense" and get calls their way. That's what happens when you have a terrible referee like Dick Bavetta (or as I call him, Mr. Burns) reffing. There are two things I don't understand concerning Pop's lineup however. #1. Why is Matt Bonner still starting? He's virtually useless if he doesn't get to chuck up atleast a couple 3's a game. He took one shot last night, had four personal fouls, while his sub Drew Gooden had 8 points off the bench. Start Gooden! #2. Why is George Hill no longer playing? The kid who outplayed Derrick Rose earlier in the season isn't getting any minutes? Instead we're playing Mason at the backup point whose handles give me nightmares....

That said, I said this would be a long series, it's going seven games.

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Sun Apr 19, 2009 12:36 pm
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
jkberden wrote:
Evenflow8112 wrote:
Boston... meh. No indication of the series, really, but discouraging nonetheless. They can beat the Bulls sans KG, and should.


Boston losing Game 1 of the playoffs is no indication of the series??? Would it be fair to say its no indication of the C's rest of the playoffs too? A team that truly relied on home court last year in the playoffs??? Fine, I will give the defending champs (albeit one without arguably its biggest cog) the benefit of the doubt and accept the cliche that they have the intangibles and "know how" to win. Fine, fine. Yet them losing home court advantage, in a game they let a rookie essentially beat them, is no big deal, but the Cavs losing a final regular season game is? The Cavs were basically giving that game away since they started the first 5 fans with courtside seats. That loss will come back to haunt them, but this one is not major for the Celtics? Interesting analysis....


It's jarring, but it doesn't decide anything. The Celetics started off slow last playoffs, escaping from a seven game series. In fact, DunkinDan just proved you wrong the next post (while, of course, agreeing with you :roll: ) by stating that the Spurs lost the first games of their first round series during championship seasons. So, it's not major when one past champion loses in the first round, by a wider margin, to a lower seed, but it's apocalyptic for the other. I don't buy this. Glad to see Dan reverting to 'five year old' (don't wory, that means you're still a Spurs fan) status once again, by the way.

I'm waiting for Nuggets/Hornets tonight. Lakers/Jazz w/o Okur, not really. Still, Utah is in a good 'surprise' position. I haven't been this wary of an 8 spot since the Warriors, and that one turned out a bit... surprisingly. Do I expect them to win? No. Would it be entertaining if they pushed it to six? Yeah, but Deron is going to need to be perfect for that to happen. The Heat and Hawks, I have no interest in, but it all depends on how Wade plays it. If he continues from the season, I think the Heat have this one wrapped up.


Sun Apr 19, 2009 1:09 pm
Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Don't get me wrong...I'm not counting the Celtics out in this series against the Bulls. If forced to choose, I would still pick them to win the series. However, I just think this loss is more significant than you think it is. I don't want to get into how the Spurs bounced back after losses from 5 years back. Last year, the Celtics were horrible on the road in the playoffs. They went 3-9 on the road while posting a sparkling home record of 13-1. One could argue that if not for home court advantage, they would have lost in the first round to Atlanta. And now they just loss Game 1 at home, and are without their most important player for the remainder of the series, if not entire playoffs. I would be quite concerned if I was a Celtics fan.


Sun Apr 19, 2009 1:29 pm
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Post Re: I Don't Know How Many Basketball Fans We Have Here, But...
Evenflow8112 wrote:
jkberden wrote:
Evenflow8112 wrote:
Boston... meh. No indication of the series, really, but discouraging nonetheless. They can beat the Bulls sans KG, and should.


Boston losing Game 1 of the playoffs is no indication of the series??? Would it be fair to say its no indication of the C's rest of the playoffs too? A team that truly relied on home court last year in the playoffs??? Fine, I will give the defending champs (albeit one without arguably its biggest cog) the benefit of the doubt and accept the cliche that they have the intangibles and "know how" to win. Fine, fine. Yet them losing home court advantage, in a game they let a rookie essentially beat them, is no big deal, but the Cavs losing a final regular season game is? The Cavs were basically giving that game away since they started the first 5 fans with courtside seats. That loss will come back to haunt them, but this one is not major for the Celtics? Interesting analysis....


It's jarring, but it doesn't decide anything. The Celetics started off slow last playoffs, escaping from a seven game series. In fact, DunkinDan just proved you wrong the next post (while, of course, agreeing with you :roll: ) by stating that the Spurs lost the first games of their first round series during championship seasons. So, it's not major when one past champion loses in the first round, by a wider margin, to a lower seed, but it's apocalyptic for the other. I don't buy this. Glad to see Dan reverting to 'five year old' (don't wory, that means you're still a Spurs fan) status once again, by the way.

I'm waiting for Nuggets/Hornets tonight. Lakers/Jazz w/o Okur, not really. Still, Utah is in a good 'surprise' position. I haven't been this wary of an 8 spot since the Warriors, and that one turned out a bit... surprisingly. Do I expect them to win? No. Would it be entertaining if they pushed it to six? Yeah, but Deron is going to need to be perfect for that to happen. The Heat and Hawks, I have no interest in, but it all depends on how Wade plays it. If he continues from the season, I think the Heat have this one wrapped up.


Hey, speaking of contradictions, you called me out earlier in this thread for "name-calling" when I said you were a bandwagoner, right? Now your calling me a five year old? That's classy. By the way, spell "worry" right :), since apparently I can't spell any words wrong here.

By the way, how did I disprove jkberden? I said the Spurs lost GAME 1 in the FIRST ROUND in 03, 05, and 07, ironically the same years they won the title. That proves that history has shown that for this team at least, it doesn't mean anything, since they've been able to bounce back. The Celtics last year WON GAME 1 in their FIRST ROUND SERIES against the Hawks. So again, your wrong.

Garnett is the heart and soul of that Boston team, and you can see the team starting to panic a bit (as seen through Rivers tirade yesterday saying "Forget about Kevin Garnett!") since they don't have him and they lost to a fearless Chicago team.

By the way where did either of us say it was apocalyptic that they lost Game 1 to the Bulls? Ohhhh, because we never said that. All we said is that its alarming to lose LIKE that while giving up 36 points to a rookie point guard (who is good, but you guys made him like MJ good yesterday). The Celtics weren't being looked at as being in trouble before this series began, everyone expected, like you, for them to make quick work out of the Bulls. The Mavs-Spurs series, everyone I know of, including me, said it would be a tight series and it would go either 6 or 7.

I'm still waiting for you to answer some earlier questions I posed in this thread too, I'd really like to hear your responses since your clearly above everyone else here when it comes to basketball knowledge.

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Sun Apr 19, 2009 1:52 pm
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