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Amanda Knox 
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Post Amanda Knox
Anyone hear thinks she actually did it and do you think she will be extradited. With a high profile case like this you have to wonder why is it this case that got attention. Let me say that I don't think she did it. Although weirder things have happened. Ever since the O.J trial and maybe even before O.J trial people have gotten real cynical over the law.


Sat Feb 01, 2014 9:20 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
I don't think she should be extradited. She finally makes it home to her country, to only face being shipped off again by her own government? Land of the free?...not so much.


Sat Feb 01, 2014 10:01 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
Hell no I don't think she did it, the Italian court system is beyond corrupt. The verdict dosen't matter though because there is no way on earth she will be extradited to Italy thanks to a little thing called Double Jeopardy.


Sat Feb 01, 2014 10:21 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
Vexer wrote:
Hell no I don't think she did it, the Italian court system is beyond corrupt. The verdict dosen't matter though because there is no way on earth she will be extradited to Italy thanks to a little thing called Double Jeopardy.


Most international lawyers think she will be. Double Jeopardy also doesn't technically apply...something about she was convicted, and she was appealed and the acquittal for her appeal was set aside and never actually processed or something technical like that. I don't understand the complexities of it because I have no knowledge of international law...but I would put her at 75% being extradited...not that I agree with it.


Sat Feb 01, 2014 10:49 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
roastbeef_ajus wrote:
Vexer wrote:
Hell no I don't think she did it, the Italian court system is beyond corrupt. The verdict dosen't matter though because there is no way on earth she will be extradited to Italy thanks to a little thing called Double Jeopardy.


Most international lawyers think she will be. Double Jeopardy also doesn't technically apply...something about she was convicted, and she was appealed and the acquittal for her appeal was set aside and never actually processed or something technical like that. I don't understand the complexities of it because I have no knowledge of international law...but I would put her at 75% being extradited...not that I agree with it.

I would say the odds of her getting extradited are only about 10%, it's highly unlikely the US would be so willing to hand over one of their citizens, especially after she was already found innocent.

If worst comes to worst, she can always move to a county that has no extradition treaty with Italy.


Sat Feb 01, 2014 10:55 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
I doubt she'll be extradited. She has the sympathies of the American public. Our leaders have to think twice about their careers once we've gotten our dander up about something.

Besides, when was the last time we gave a crap about offending another country?

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Sun Feb 02, 2014 2:09 am
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
Ken wrote:
I doubt she'll be extradited. She has the sympathies of the American public. Our leaders have to think twice about their careers once we've gotten our dander up about something.

Besides, when was the last time we gave a crap about offending another country?

Why should anyone give a shit if Italy is "offended" over this? The way the evidence in the case was handled was just embarassing, it was like they Keystone Cops over there, it was clear there was nowhere near enough evidence to support Knox's conviction yet they went ahead anyways, probably just cause she's American therefore she's EEEEEEEEVIL :roll:


Sun Feb 02, 2014 2:13 am
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
I think dismissing this case entirely on "Italian corruption" is wrong, and more importantly, incorrect.

The facts are that Knox's first and second drafts of what happened on that night are alarmingly obvious as being bullshit. She also tried to pin it on a guy who worked in a local bar (who she just didn't like personally).

The fact of the matter is that the first case was badly organised thanks to the Police who were out of their depth (like most provincial police forces are on cases like this). The appeal court took this into account when they acquitted her (which was their duty), but now a subsequent hearing has found that the original facts do implicate guilt.

I don't think any of this points to corruption in the courts. The initial investigation was severely incompetent - but this probably works in Knox's favour because although she wasn't the hand that killed the victim, I bet she knows a damn sight more than she's letting on.

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Mon Feb 03, 2014 6:47 am
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
NotHughGrant wrote:
I think dismissing this case entirely on "Italian corruption" is wrong, and more importantly, incorrect.

The facts are that Knox's first and second drafts of what happened on that night are alarmingly obvious as being bullshit. She also tried to pin it on a guy who worked in a local bar (who she just didn't like personally).

The fact of the matter is that the first case was badly organised thanks to the Police who were out of their depth (like most provincial police forces are on cases like this). The appeal court took this into account when they acquitted her (which was their duty), but now a subsequent hearing has found that the original facts do implicate guilt.

I don't think any of this points to corruption in the courts. The initial investigation was severely incompetent - but this probably works in Knox's favour because although she wasn't the hand that killed the victim, I bet she knows a damn sight more than she's letting on.

Um, no they are not "bullshit" at all :roll: Knox only mentioned that bar owner because she was intimidated and broken into naming someone by her interrogators, it wasn't cause "she didn't like him" that's the dumbest thing i've ever heard :evil:

This "appeal" is a complete and utter joke, the fact that she was already acquitted once should've been enough common sense for the courts to realize there was very little evidence that she had anything to do with Kercher's murder.

The fact is the REAL murderer is already in jail, this just a classic case of Italy doing saber-rattling.


Mon Feb 03, 2014 6:51 am
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
I'm not doubting the lack of physical evidence, nor the role it should play.

But read the accounts of what Knox says happened that night. All versions.

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Mon Feb 03, 2014 6:53 am
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
I don't know whether she did it or not, but she has been convicted in a foreign court, and if the countries were reversed, the US would damn well expect her to be extradited.

The UK currently has a one-sided extradition treaty with the US. There are several cases in the UK press of UK nationals being extradited to the US for "crimes" that are not illegal in the UK. This extradition traffic is mostly one-way.


Mon Feb 03, 2014 7:41 am
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
Alex wrote:
I don't know whether she did it or not, but she has been convicted in a foreign court, and if the countries were reversed, the US would damn well expect her to be extradited.

The UK currently has a one-sided extradition treaty with the US. There are several cases in the UK press of UK nationals being extradited to the US for "crimes" that are not illegal in the UK. This extradition traffic is mostly one-way.

Welcome to U.S. politics. We do like to get our way, don't we?

Not that I think Knox should be extradited. Had Knox been tried in an American court, she would likely be found not guilty according to our own legal principles. While Italy doesn't share some of those principles, we are in a position to protect one of our own citizens and they are in a position to make ineffectual demands. That's just how it is.

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Mon Feb 03, 2014 8:09 am
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
Vexer wrote:
Hell no I don't think she did it, the Italian court system is beyond corrupt. The verdict dosen't matter though because there is no way on earth she will be extradited to Italy thanks to a little thing called Double Jeopardy.


The Italian court system is “beyond corrupt”? Well, I would normally bow to your greater insight into these matters, particularly because you are from a country, which has a famously infallible judicial system. However, I have been involved with Italian court cases in the past and the Italian courts seemed to be quite efficient, certainly more so than my experience with the court systems of, Belgium, Greece or Spain. Then there’s the fact that Italian prosecutors and judges have been targeted by organised crime figures (look up Giovanni Falcone and Paolo Borselino) and that former long-time Italian prime minister Silvio Berlusconi was prosecuted for, amongst others, corruption charges in many instances. But why let the facts get in the way of a good old national stereotype, eh?

Knox and Sollecito were convicted of simulating an offence, sexual assault, murder and slander by a court of first instance. On appeal by the defendants, the appellate court overturned the convictions for simulating an offence, sexual assault and murder, but upheld the conviction for slander (wrongful accusation of a third person, who was demonstrably not involved in the murder) and actually increased the sentence for the latter conviction. In Italy (as in many other jurisdictions), there is the further possibility for an appeal on the grounds of law or procedure to the Court of Cassation. On appeal by the public prosecutor, the Court of Cassation annulled the judgment by the appellate court (due to a misinterpratation of evidence by the appellate court and citing severe lapses in logic, I believe) and ordered a retrial. This retrial has now taken place and Knox and Sollecito have again been found guilty, although the judgment is not yet final and will most likely be subject to an appeal.

As there has been no final court decision on the indictment as yet, this is not a case of Double Jeopardy. It could perhaps be argued that the situation is that of a mistrial, so that, depending on the exact circumstances, the rules on Double Jeopardy might prevent a retrial according to U.S. Law, which, depending on the extradition treaty between Italy and the U.S., might allow for a refusal to extradite Knox based on ordre public. That's three "Ifs", though. be that as it may, the decision about an extradition cannot be based on the popularity of the extradition or whether it is politically opportune to do so.

Vexer wrote:
Ken wrote:
I doubt she'll be extradited. She has the sympathies of the American public. Our leaders have to think twice about their careers once we've gotten our dander up about something.

Besides, when was the last time we gave a crap about offending another country?

Why should anyone give a shit if Italy is "offended" over this? The way the evidence in the case was handled was just embarassing, it was like they Keystone Cops over there, it was clear there was nowhere near enough evidence to support Knox's conviction yet they went ahead anyways, probably just cause she's American therefore she's EEEEEEEEVIL :roll:


Why should anybody give a shit whether “Italy is offended”? Because it would mean that the U.S. do not keep their obligations under international law and other nations might be less inclined to enter into international agreements wiith the U.S. or to fulfill their under existing international law. For instance, why should Italy care if the convicted heads of the five families of the New York mafia would enjoy their retirement in Italy while some American state attorney gnashes his teeth in anger, if the U.S. don't extradite convicted criminals?

What makes you so sure about Knox's innocence, by the way? Could it be because she is American and, therefore, cannot be EEEEEEVIL? The Italian authorities have shown less xenophobia than you have: The victim is British and the Italian authorities still investigate and prosecute to the best of their abilities (which, i the case of the securing of evidence by Perugia police isn't saying much, it would seem). And apart from Knox, an Italian and and Ivorian have been convicted.


Mon Feb 03, 2014 8:56 am
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
If Italy is so damn perfect, how come they refused to honor the US's extradition request for that one mobster? So the U.S. has no reason to hand over Knox for that reason alone.

There's no "xenophobia" here :roll: i'm just speaking the truth, according to Italian citizens there IS a bias against US tourists in the courts systems and it no doubt played a part in this new verdict.

There's still many factors that could prevent Knox from being extradited, refusing to do so would not automatically mean the U.S. isn't "honoring" it's treaty, there's many steps that have to be taken before extradition is even carried out, first her case has to be evaluated in the U.S. by a court to determine whether or not she truly is guilty and then that decision still has to get approved by an attorney, and the odds of that happening are about a trillion to one, the courts here are not going to declare her guilty.

Also for all we know, Italy may not even file an extradition request.

Oh and I have read Knox's accounts and they make perfect sense to me.

The policia essentially forced Knox to implicate someone else through a long and intense interrogation, that's the same tactic corrupt cops over here used to to get one of the West Memphis Three to confess to a crime he did not committ(I know our justice system isn't perfect, but i'd much rather take my chances here then in Italy).


Mon Feb 03, 2014 2:54 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
Knox's accounts make sense? Jeez, Vex. Have you fucking read them?

I suggest reading version 2 of her story. A fantastic work of demonstrable fiction. Knox is a liar. This is established fact.

Version 2 is the one she later said she 'dreamed', in a letter to her Lawyers.

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Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:08 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
NotHughGrant wrote:
Knox's accounts make sense? Jeez, Vex. Have you fucking read them?

I suggest reading version 2 of her story. A fantastic work of demonstrable fiction. Knox is a liar. This is established fact.

Version 2 is the one she later said she 'dreamed', in a letter to her Lawyers.

Yes they made sense and yes I read them, if you don't believe me that's your problem, not mine.

Knox is NOT a liar, that's just YOUR opinion and NOT a fact :roll:

THe only one I see spouting a "work of fiction" here is you.


Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:13 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
Jesus, Vex, give it up. You're outgunned here. Personally, I don't give a shit about the case, which is why I've kept my mouth shut. To avoid looking foolish and all, you know.

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Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:26 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
Contradictory accounts make her a liar, not a murderer. That's one of my questions about the case: if the investigation was botched so badly, how in the world do they have sufficient evidence to prove a murder? I realize this may be a difference between the Italian court system and ours, but I believe in this particular aspect of our court system. You can't accuse someone of the worst crime without having the best evidence.

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Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:31 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
Sexual Chocolate wrote:
Jesus, Vex, give it up. You're outgunned here. Personally, I don't give a shit about the case, which is why I've kept my mouth shut. To avoid looking foolish and all, you know.

Give what up? :? If you don't care about the case that's fine, but I do and i'm not going to "give it up" just cause you say so, you're not the boss of me.

I fail to see how I look "foolish" just for calling this case exactly what it is-an injustice.

I really don't give a shit what you or anyone else thinks, so why don't you give it up(whatever "it" is)?
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Last edited by Vexer on Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:32 pm
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Post Re: Amanda Knox
Ken wrote:
Contradictory accounts make her a liar, not a murderer. That's one of my questions about the case: if the investigation was botched so badly, how in the world do they have sufficient evidence to prove a murder? I realize this may be a difference between the Italian court system and ours, but I believe in this particular aspect of our court system. You can't accuse someone of the worst crime without having the best evidence.

Exactly my point, the fact that the evidence was badly handled by some of the most incompetent cops known to man yet still resulted in a guilty verdict is the main reason why most people are calling bullshit on this case.


Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:37 pm
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