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January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art" 
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Post Re: January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art"
Vexer wrote:
I hope for Allen's sake that it's not true, but if it is he should indeed have to answer for it.

I don't think Dylan should be blaming the actors who star in Allen's films though since it's not like they knew anything about this.

I don't think her issue is with people who've worked with Allen, but for people who've stuck up for Allen. I could be wrong.

Mind you, as we discussed earlier in this thread, many people in the filmmaking community have stuck up for Roman Polanski, despite his crime being a matter of public record.

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Sun Feb 02, 2014 7:21 am
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Post Re: January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art"
Ken wrote:
Vexer wrote:
I hope for Allen's sake that it's not true, but if it is he should indeed have to answer for it.

I don't think Dylan should be blaming the actors who star in Allen's films though since it's not like they knew anything about this.

I don't think her issue is with people who've worked with Allen, but for people who've stuck up for Allen. I could be wrong.

Mind you, as we discussed earlier in this thread, many people in the filmmaking community have stuck up for Roman Polanski, despite his crime being a matter of public record.


Well Roman Polanski has the fact that as statutory rape it was (nominally) consensual, and his wife was butchered by Charles Manson. That gives him a bit of a pass in some peoples' minds. But perhaps that's neither here nor there.

Goddamn it I always defended Woody Allen because the Soon-Yi thing seemed defensible to me. Now I feel much more conflicted.

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Sun Feb 02, 2014 10:25 am
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Post Re: January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art"
Ken wrote:
Vexer wrote:
I hope for Allen's sake that it's not true, but if it is he should indeed have to answer for it.

I don't think Dylan should be blaming the actors who star in Allen's films though since it's not like they knew anything about this.

I don't think her issue is with people who've worked with Allen, but for people who've stuck up for Allen. I could be wrong.

Mind you, as we discussed earlier in this thread, many people in the filmmaking community have stuck up for Roman Polanski, despite his crime being a matter of public record.

True, I was surprised that Jodie Foster stuck up for him.


Sun Feb 02, 2014 1:51 pm
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Post Re: January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art"
JamesKunz wrote:
Well Roman Polanski has the fact that as statutory rape it was (nominally) consensual, and his wife was butchered by Charles Manson. That gives him a bit of a pass in some peoples' minds. But perhaps that's neither here nor there.

That people consider it consensual is the most disturbing thing about it, really. I'm still waiting for a sea change in our society on that one.

But therein lies a key issue with the Allen thing as well. We know Polanski did what he was accused of. He admitted it in court. So in a way, it makes it much easier to debate how much we separate or conflate artists' lives with their work. In Allen's case, we have a plausible allegation, but not a confirmation, and that's what has me especially conflicted. It leaves me with an unsure idea of how I should be viewing this man.

It is noble to say that we can make a full separation between artists and their works, but that's not really how our culture operates, especially not with artists who are still living. I have no doubt that the timing of this letter is because it is the man being celebrated, not just the work.

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Sun Feb 02, 2014 2:14 pm
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Post Re: January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art"
Ken wrote:
It is noble to say that we can make a full separation between artists and their works, but that's not really how our culture operates, especially not with artists who are still living.




It's also really, really hard when the guy makes a whole bunch of movies about May-December romances. It's a lot easier to separate what Polanski did from Chinatown and The Pianist than what Allen [allegedly] did from Manhattan and the like

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Sun Feb 02, 2014 2:20 pm
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Post Re: January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art"
Statement from Allen's publicist:

"It is tragic that after 20 years a story engineered by a vengeful lover resurfaces after it was fully vetted and rejected by independent authorities. The one to blame for Dylan's distress is neither Dylan nor Woody Allen."

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Post Re: January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art"
Never been a fan of either Allen's or Polanski's films for the most part. That was a painful read from Dylan as I do have a 7 year old daughter. I never know what to believe for sure with these kind of reports though and find it very difficult to directly affix blame without personally knowing the character of those involved. I thought Take the Money and Run was quite funny when I viewed it way back in the day and think Chinatown is one of the better movies I've seen in my lifetime.

I will say this, after imagining this happening to my daughter, my imagination continues to the point where no one would need to consider the moral ramifications of evaluating the perpetrator's future works. Can't imagine any parent feeling differently, although I know that many do.


Mon Feb 03, 2014 10:26 am
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Post Re: January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art"
CasualDad wrote:
Never been a fan of either Allen's or Polanski's films for the most part. That was a painful read from Dylan as I do have a 7 year old daughter. I never know what to believe for sure with these kind of reports though and find it very difficult to directly affix blame without personally knowing the character of those involved. I thought Take the Money and Run was quite funny when I viewed it way back in the day and think Chinatown is one of the better movies I've seen in my lifetime.

I will say this, after imagining this happening to my daughter, my imagination continues to the point where no one would need to consider the moral ramifications of evaluating the perpetrator's future works. Can't imagine any parent feeling differently, although I know that many do.


Though do remember that these are alleged occurrences, and that molestation accusations are incredibly common in difficult custody disputes

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Mon Feb 03, 2014 10:45 am
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Post Re: January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art"
JamesKunz wrote:
CasualDad wrote:
Never been a fan of either Allen's or Polanski's films for the most part. That was a painful read from Dylan as I do have a 7 year old daughter. I never know what to believe for sure with these kind of reports though and find it very difficult to directly affix blame without personally knowing the character of those involved. I thought Take the Money and Run was quite funny when I viewed it way back in the day and think Chinatown is one of the better movies I've seen in my lifetime.

I will say this, after imagining this happening to my daughter, my imagination continues to the point where no one would need to consider the moral ramifications of evaluating the perpetrator's future works. Can't imagine any parent feeling differently, although I know that many do.


Though do remember that these are alleged allegations, and that molestation accusations are incredibly common in difficult custody disputes


Certainly. I have two friends that, in the midst of divorce and custody cases, were accused of abuses to their wives and children that (in my opinion) are not in any way consistent with their character as I know it. In the absence of physical evidence, no one really knows except for the accuser and accused.


Mon Feb 03, 2014 10:58 am
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Post Re: January 11, 2012: "When a Monster Makes Art"
In Allen's case, he does have a thing for reeeaaally young women, which is hardly evidence for child molestation... but it's evidence that he's a weird dude. I know that it shouldn't influence the way people evaluate the things he's been accused of, but it probably does and it's hard to not let it happen.

Compounding the issue for me is that while I can recognize its quality, I've never been a huge fan of Allen's work. He's one of those directors who I'd hardly dismiss, but at the same time, I wouldn't bring any of his movies with me to a desert island. So maybe I'm not as skeptical of the charges as I would be with a director whose work I have more of an interest in.

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Mon Feb 03, 2014 1:01 pm
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