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September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?" 
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Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
Ken wrote:
ed_metal_head wrote:
Has anyone heard that the actor who played Darth Vader has never received any residual payments for Return of the Jedi? Why? The studio claims that Return of the Jedi has never seen a profit! Hollywood accounting at its best (worst). Someone really needs to have a look at the studios' books. People have gone to jail for less.

http://www.slashfilm.com/lucasfilm-tells-darth-vader-that-return-of-the-jedi-hasnt-made-a-profit/

The sad thing is that this happens all the time and it's usually pretty immaculate from a legal standpoint--not just in Hollywood, but in the entire entertainment industry, from the upper echelon to the lower. Number crunchers do not like to make concessions on the behalf of their employers.

Just look at Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster. They sold Superman for a paycheck and a promise of regular work. Imagine coming up with Mickey Mouse or James Bond and getting a check for it while the new corporate owner goes on to rake in money hand over fist.


Another example of where Lucas was brilliant in retaining the merchandising and sequel rights to the original movie, where Fox thought they were getting the better deal.


Wed Sep 21, 2011 4:38 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
That was a bit of a gamble on his part. But yeah, it paid off, and he became wealthy by his own bootstraps. I think that's one of the things that people don't like about him.


Wed Sep 21, 2011 4:53 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
I think there was an issue where Vader's physical presence (Prowse) wasn't in enough of the movie (he didn't do his fight scenes for a start). Still unfair but tragically these issues do crop up.


Wed Sep 21, 2011 4:57 pm
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Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
calvero wrote:
Speaking at a screening of Raiders in downtown Los Angeles for its 30th Anniversary, All Things Fangirl reports (via Slashfilm) that Spielberg was asked about the recent reports that Lucas had made even more changes to his Star Wars movies for their upcoming Blu-ray release. While Spielberg acknowledged the changes he made to E.T. for the extended, 20th Anniversary version released in 2002 (changes that included replacing the police's guns with walkie-talkies), he also admitted that he "regretted that."

Quote:
Let me put it this way. George does what he does cause there is only one George Lucas and thank god for that. He's the greatest person I've ever worked with as a filmmaker and collaborator, he is a conceptual genius, he puts together these amazing stories and he is great at what he does. And my feeling is he can do whatever he wants with his movies because those are his movies. We wouldn't have been raised with Star Wars or Indiana Jones had it not been for George, so what he does with his films is great.

Speaking for myself, you know, I tried this once and I lived to regret it. Not because of fan outrage, but simply because I was disappointed in myself. I was overly sensitive to some of the criticism E.T. got from parent groups when it was first released in '82 having to do with Eliot saying "Penis Breath" or the guns...and then there were certain brilliant, but rough around the edges close ups of ET that I always felt, if technology ever evolves to the point where I can do some facial enhancement for E.T., I'd like to. So I did an E.T. pass for like the third release of the movie and it was okay for a while, but then I realized that what I had done was I had robbed the people who loved E.T. of their memories of E.T. And I regretted that. (massive applause) And the only contrition that I could possibly do because I felt bad about that was, the only contrition that I really performed was when E.T. came out on DVD for the first time, I asked Universal, I didn't ask Universal, I said you're gonna do this, when you release this on DVD you have to come out for the same price of one DVD, you have to put two movies in the box and one movie will be the 1982 version and the other will be the digitally enhanced version. I'd like to ask you this, let's do a little poll here, cause I know we're coming out with the Blu-Ray of E.T., if I just came out with one E.T. on Blu-Ray, [the] 1982 [version], would anyone object to that? (loud NO from the audience). Okay then, so be it. (huge applause)


http://www.reelz.com/movie-news/11794/s ... y-release/


I thought the only things wrong with the '02 cut were the PC changes he made (like it or not, those men WOULD have had guns; and WHY would Mary object to Michael wanting to dress up as a hippie for Halloween???... especially when I'd imagine she was one herself :? -- these were post-9/11 knee-jerk alterations) and jazzing up the spaceship (E.T.'s species seemed far too modest for having all those bells and whistles on their mode of transport); otherwise I'd say it was superior. The SFX were at least improved... particularly when E.T. is running back to his ship; no longer does it look like what it was, i.e. a dummy being pulled along track. :P Alas, as with "Apocalypse Now" and "Superman II," there will likely never be a definitive cut of this film made available to the public. :|


Wed Sep 21, 2011 6:14 pm
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Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
Ken wrote:
That was a bit of a gamble on his part. But yeah, it paid off, and he became wealthy by his own bootstraps. I think that's one of the things that people don't like about him.

I don't think that anyone would begrudge Lucas his wealth if he proved himself capable of crafting good films with the SW prequels. However, he did not, so many people, including myself, feel cheated out of the money we spent watching those films, much like we would with any other crap film.


Wed Sep 21, 2011 8:29 pm
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Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
Patrick wrote:
iljitsch wrote:
What's that thing about Indiana Jones? I hadn't heard anything about changes to those movies before.

There are no changes, Kingdom of the Crystal Skull just sucked really bad*.

*Not really, but I'm in the minority on this one.

Actually, there were changes to Raiders of the Lost Ark. There was a pane of glass between Indy and the cobra in the Well of Souls, and the cobra's reflection was digitally removed on the DVD. The scene where Gobler goes over the cliff was also redone with CGI, but isn't on the DVD. It has been seen on TV airings though. Hopefully Spielberg's recent comments concerning E.T. mean that these won't end up on the upcoming Blu-ray release.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_sFW8grQtU


Wed Sep 21, 2011 9:29 pm
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Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
ed_metal_head wrote:
Has anyone heard that the actor who played Darth Vader has never received any residual payments for Return of the Jedi? Why? The studio claims that Return of the Jedi has never seen a profit! Hollywood accounting at its best (worst). Someone really needs to have a look at the studios' books. People have gone to jail for less.


Not surprisingly, David Prowse (who played Vader) and Lucas have had a falling out.

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Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:20 am
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Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
I'm surprised James became such a big Star Wars fan after having already been a Star Trek fan. Which not wholly mutually exclusive, there always has been a competition of sorts.

I like the (original) first 2 Star Wars movies alot, though my appreciation for that took a while to develop. I was way to star struck back then by Star Trek, it was everything to me as a 12yo in 1977.

The main problem I always had with Star Wars that the original Star Trek never seems to have an issue with was that when someone shot a weapon in Star Trek, it actually cause some damage. In Star Wars, those ridiculous laser guns get shot every which way, at anything and everything, and only when it is convenient to the story does it hurt someone.

Personally, I think GLucas has become a joke. His power play? Thats the work of a 12yo in 1977. All he seems to want is to create controversy and get more people to buy and buy and buy.


Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:34 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
I've noticed a pattern with Star Wars opinions; is ROTJ really the Godfather 3 of this franchise? It's as good as the other two I feel!


Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:24 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
Dragonbeard wrote:
I've noticed a pattern with Star Wars opinions; is ROTJ really the Godfather 3 of this franchise? It's as good as the other two I feel!


I like most of it, but I think Lucas got a little too "cutesy" with the puppetry in ROTJ. There wasn't much "whimsy" in the first 2 and then you have this tonal shift in #3.


Thu Sep 22, 2011 3:58 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
Dragonbeard wrote:
I've noticed a pattern with Star Wars opinions; is ROTJ really the Godfather 3 of this franchise? It's as good as the other two I feel!


I also find it to be very good even though it doesn't hit the levels of "Star Wars" and "Empire". I don't think the Ewoks are as awful as people make them. I'll take them over the Gungans any day. The movie does satisfy the requirements of a conclusion and wraps things up. I think we would have gotten a better film if Lucas and co. followed the original ideas of killing off Han Solo, making things dark and dramatic, etc. I have to admit this movie "plays things safe" instead of being bold and going for a dramatic conclusion. If Lucas and co. decided to be bold I think we would have gotten a much better film that would be along the lines of "LOTR: Return of the King" as far as drama and emotion go. But still, despite this I enjoy the film as is and find it to be a satisfying conclusion.


Thu Sep 22, 2011 5:09 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
"How about Hayden Christensen at the end of Jedi. Again, it doesn't bother me. It makes sense for future fans who watch the entire saga from start to finish. They will appreciate seeing "their" Anakin redeemed. People who want to complain about Sebastian Shaw need to remember that he had, what, about 60 seconds of screen time? Compared to a few hours for Christensen. That's just sour grapes."

Sebastian Shaw conveyed more in his 60 seconds than what Hayden Christensen conveyed in his two films. What does that tell you? :P


Thu Sep 22, 2011 5:39 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
Return of the Jedi draws a lot of its energy from the first two films. It relies upon the fact that you already know the characters and are invested in what happens to them. Without that, much of it is rehash and most of the meaningful developments occur near the end. I won't say it's a bad movie, but it's the one that thrives most on the good will of the people watching it.

MrGuinness wrote:
I'm surprised James became such a big Star Wars fan after having already been a Star Trek fan. Which not wholly mutually exclusive, there always has been a competition of sorts.
I was like that when I was a kid. I like Star Wars, so I couldn't like Star Trek. This changed once I realized that there's no reason to think that way, though a lot of fanboys seem to carry this mentality into adulthood.

Funny thing is, even though I didn't know anything about Star Trek, a lot of my preconceptions were pretty spot-on. Shitty special effects, lots of scenes of people standing/sitting around in a room talking, etc.


Thu Sep 22, 2011 5:56 pm
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Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
ck100 wrote:
"How about Hayden Christensen at the end of Jedi. Again, it doesn't bother me. It makes sense for future fans who watch the entire saga from start to finish. They will appreciate seeing "their" Anakin redeemed. People who want to complain about Sebastian Shaw need to remember that he had, what, about 60 seconds of screen time? Compared to a few hours for Christensen. That's just sour grapes."

Sebastian Shaw conveyed more in his 60 seconds than what Hayden Christensen conveyed in his two films. What does that tell you? :P


Also, I've always felt that the decision to insert Christensen completely disrespects the work of David Prowse, who gave Vader so much presence. Sure, it was Shaw who played the unmasking, but everything Prowse did was essential for making that scene work.

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Fri Sep 23, 2011 3:17 am
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Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
Ken wrote:
Funny thing is, even though I didn't know anything about Star Trek, a lot of my preconceptions were pretty spot-on. Shitty special effects, lots of scenes of people standing/sitting around in a room talking, etc.


Oh no! Character development! Run! Hide! :)


Fri Sep 23, 2011 4:48 am
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
The BBC's Arts Editor weighs in:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-14944240


Fri Sep 23, 2011 8:17 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
I am the 666th viewer of this thread. If you would all kindly go to your iTunes library and cue up "Number of the Beast"...

I think the BBC article makes a good point. It's not just about piling on endless changes that annoy the fans in the here and now. It's revisionist history. Not just the act of changing the films, but the act of suppressing the non-changed versions, like the memory hole in 1984. And, while George Lucas is the original author, cultural history belongs to the audiences just as much as the artists. I wish he'd understand that.

Imagine if the bids to destroy Citizen Kane or the Rules of the Game had been successful. Imagine if all those B&W films were intentionally left in disrepair, forever replaced by colorized versions passed off as the originals. It's a troubling thought.

I don't mind special editions. I do mind "It was this way all along, I swear!" editions.


Fri Sep 23, 2011 9:12 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
MrGuinness wrote:
Ken wrote:
Funny thing is, even though I didn't know anything about Star Trek, a lot of my preconceptions were pretty spot-on. Shitty special effects, lots of scenes of people standing/sitting around in a room talking, etc.


Oh no! Character development! Run! Hide! :)


It's a good thing the recent movie went and made Star Trek great again :)


Fri Sep 23, 2011 9:37 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
Recently read an interview with John Morton, who played Dak in Empire Strikes Back. I know, I know...a bit actor...but at least he was IN the movie. [I did not know that a) his voice was dubbed in the final shots of the movie (most of the actors with only 1 or 2 lines were dubbed later) and b) he played Boba Fett in one scene as well; standing outside the room on Bespin when Vader exits torchuring Han].

Anyway...the subject of the Blu Rays came up and here's what Morton had to say:

John Morton wrote:
So many people have been invited into the franchise. Artists, toy designers, authors. You even got people making fan films. It has become a collaborative venture between Lucas and his fans. The question then becomes, "Well, who then actually owns the 'Star Wars' universe?" I think the fans have a good case to say to George, "Both versions should be available." But on the other hand, if George decides he wants to have a different interpretation of a scene whether Han shot first or not, that's his right as well. He is kind of the first among equals, and he can go ahead and do that. But then you have a case, "Oh, by the way, you can't have the original version," that I think is wrong. What Lucas is not allowing is the work of art that had the impact on the fans the way it did when it was done. That's being denied them, and I think that's wrong.


Fri Sep 23, 2011 9:45 pm
Post Re: September 19, 2011: "George Lucas: Childhood Rapist?"
Dragonbeard wrote:
It's a good thing the recent movie went and made Star Trek great again :)
I get the cut of your jib, but let's not kid ourselves. The new movie provides a bukkake of modern-style jumbled action bits and flashing things, but at its heart of hearts, it's a piecemeal reshuffling of Wrath of Khan and various other fan-favorite moments.

Super 8 proved that JJ Abrams can shoot and cut coherently when he feels like it (not often), so I hope that the next movie--whichever classic story it rehashes with its younger, prettier cast--comes together in a more classical style.


Fri Sep 23, 2011 10:00 pm
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