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June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium" 
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Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
Dave P. wrote:
I too miss the association of fandom. Who knows if I'll ever get the Arrested Development movie I've been waiting 4 years for.

James Berardinelli wrote:
Star Wars, in addition to being a merchandise king, added five more movies and a few TV shows.

Six movies if you count the animated "Star Wars: The Clone Wars."


What about the Ewok live action movies?


Wed Jun 30, 2010 10:20 am
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Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
ed_metal_head wrote:
Do you watch South Park? There was an episode called The Ungroundable [wikipedia.org] that dealt with this very issue. Basically, the Goths were quite upset they were being confused with "Vampire Kids" who shopped at Hot Topic.


I do watch South Park, and I have seen that episode. It's great. I loved the part at the end where Parker and Stone made a song called "Burn Down Hot Topic" that sounded just like Joy Division. I was laughing my ass off.

Ragnarok73 wrote:
It's funny when a musician creates a song that appeals to a different audience, then derides them for liking that song. Personally, the only song by them that I really liked was the one they contributed to the soundtrack for The Crow, but I guess Smith wasn't really aiming at that segment of the population either, right?


I get what you're saying, but I think Smith may have been targeting all the people who liked "Friday I'm In Love" but didn't care about the band's other music. Kind of like all of the people who liked Metallica for "Enter Sandman" or the Grateful Dead for "Touch Of Grey."

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Wed Jun 30, 2010 10:59 am
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Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
Colin wrote:
Dave P. wrote:
I too miss the association of fandom. Who knows if I'll ever get the Arrested Development movie I've been waiting 4 years for.

James Berardinelli wrote:
Star Wars, in addition to being a merchandise king, added five more movies and a few TV shows.

Six movies if you count the animated "Star Wars: The Clone Wars."


What about the Ewok live action movies?


Weren't those for television?


Wed Jun 30, 2010 4:56 pm
Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
Lord of the Rings fandom threatened to be as populous as Star Trek/Star Wars fandom in the early 2000's, but much like Harry Potter, after the films had come and gone for a few years it started to die down at Conventions and the like.

I've always been surprised that the Batman franchise hasn't inspired the same type of following, beyond what it's always had. The movies still haven't acted as selling points for the comics at all, regardless of their massive grosses...perhaps if the stories were set in the Nolan-verse?? I dunno...


Wed Jun 30, 2010 5:01 pm
Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
KEPinion wrote:
Lord of the Rings fandom threatened to be as populous as Star Trek/Star Wars fandom in the early 2000's, but much like Harry Potter, after the films had come and gone for a few years it started to die down at Conventions and the like.

This is because the LOTR trilogy was just that: a trilogy. The fans of the films by Jackson knew that once they were done, there wouldn't be any more (aside from The Hobbit which may finally get underway sometime in the next 2 years). Star Trek and Star Wars are both long-running franchises in multiple mediums (films, TV, and books among others).

KEPinion wrote:
I've always been surprised that the Batman franchise hasn't inspired the same type of following, beyond what it's always had. The movies still haven't acted as selling points for the comics at all, regardless of their massive grosses...perhaps if the stories were set in the Nolan-verse?? I dunno...

Superhero films don't quite work the same way as the films in the Star Trek and Star Wars universes. My theory is its because those films were based on characters that already had a fan following. The big names in the comic world have their legions of loyal readers: Spiderman, Batman, Superman, The X-Men, etc, etc, etc. The Star Trek and Star Wars fanbases were built off of more fleeting mediums (re: short-running TV series and 3 films).


Wed Jun 30, 2010 5:47 pm
Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
Superhero comic book readership is at an all-time low, and it's only getting lower. Film seems to be the ideal format for bringing superheroes to a wide audience. The comics and the movies don't have much to do with each other's popularity.

The main problem with the comics, aside from bad stories, is that they're being sold in an obsolete format (the long-running print serial) through outlets that were never a good idea in the first place (the comic book specialty shops). The barrier to entry is high enough that far more people are quitting the comics than are getting into them. The fanbase is slowly consuming itself.

Contrast this with the movies, which are in a far more popular medium, tell stories that are short and self-contained, and aren't only available in places that cater exclusively to geeks and creepy, obsessive collector types.

Of course, the movies are starting to list towards the same practices that make the comics so daunting and unappealing, which is probably going to contribute to their inevitable decline in popularity.


Wed Jun 30, 2010 7:29 pm
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Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
Ken wrote:
The main problem with the comics, aside from bad stories, is that they're being sold in an obsolete format (the long-running print serial) through outlets that were never a good idea in the first place (the comic book specialty shops). The barrier to entry is high enough that far more people are quitting the comics than are getting into them. The fanbase is slowly consuming itself.


When I got into comics in the late 1970s, it was possible to buy comic books in racks at drug stores, supermarkets, 7/11's, mall book stores, and Wallmart-style stores (no Walmarts or Targets in those days, but there were similar places). I only graduated to seeking out a comic book store after spending about a year getting them this way. Today, with those alternative outlets no longer available, it's no wonder comic book sales are plummeting. They have become specialty products.


Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:34 pm
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Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
Vexer wrote:
Twilight seems more like an Emo thing then a Goth thing to me.


I think given the heavily gothic theme of the stories, it wouldn't be wise to make such an observation, not unless you want to get those floppy hair cuts all messed up and... flapping about?

Perhaps it's a generational difference but the bands I consider to be "Gothic" in this day and age are the likes of Paradise Lost, Anathema, Katatonia etc. They somehow manage to write songs about very dark subject matter whilst maintaining a very high level of dignity.

Anyway back to the subject at hand; regarding the history of fandom, are we all forgetting the Beatles? Probably the first "institution" to be obsessed over to the point of madness?


Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:36 pm
Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
Dragonbeard wrote:
Anyway back to the subject at hand; regarding the history of fandom, are we all forgetting the Beatles? Probably the first "institution" to be obsessed over to the point of madness?


What about Elvis?


Wed Jun 30, 2010 10:05 pm
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Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
James Berardinelli wrote:
Ken wrote:
The main problem with the comics, aside from bad stories, is that they're being sold in an obsolete format (the long-running print serial) through outlets that were never a good idea in the first place (the comic book specialty shops). The barrier to entry is high enough that far more people are quitting the comics than are getting into them. The fanbase is slowly consuming itself.


When I got into comics in the late 1970s, it was possible to buy comic books in racks at drug stores, supermarkets, 7/11's, mall book stores, and Wallmart-style stores (no Walmarts or Targets in those days, but there were similar places). I only graduated to seeking out a comic book store after spending about a year getting them this way. Today, with those alternative outlets no longer available, it's no wonder comic book sales are plummeting. They have become specialty products.


Both are good points, but another thing that I think is worth noting is that comic books have definitely become more "adult" in tone over the past 30 years. I don't read comics much anymore, but I have a friend that does, and some of the comics he has showed me are vastly different in style and tone than what I read when I was younger. They're darker, too; I would argue that this shift has limited the audience somewhat.

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I'm collecting vinyl
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Thu Jul 01, 2010 9:30 am
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Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
Quote:
This is because the LOTR trilogy was just that: a trilogy. The fans of the films by Jackson knew that once they were done, there wouldn't be any more (aside from The Hobbit which may finally get underway sometime in the next 2 years). Star Trek and Star Wars are both long-running franchises in multiple mediums (films, TV, and books among others).


True, but while there is some limitation to the fact that it's a trilogy of books, there's also the role that the Tolkien Estate plays in the problem. Star Wars was never really guaranteed more books, television shows, etc al...but Lucas granted the license for the Expanded Universe of which alot of the furthering of Star Wars fanatics is rooted in. The Tolkien Estate hoards the Lord of the Rings rights like Gollum and puts out products fairly sparingly. Some may see the benefit in that, but it's not like you'll see any new "canon-ish" material appearing, for better or worse.

Quote:
The main problem with the comics, aside from bad stories, is that they're being sold in an obsolete format (the long-running print serial) through outlets that were never a good idea in the first place (the comic book specialty shops). The barrier to entry is high enough that far more people are quitting the comics than are getting into them. The fanbase is slowly consuming itself.


I've always felt like DC and Marvel have done terrible jobs at taking advantage of any leverage a movie like The Dark Knight or Iron Man might provide. The books that are most readily available to kids or potential new readers are completely unlike the movies. As a reader, I have no problem with that, but it's the catering to consumers like me that is contributing to the issue.
I agree that the format itself is a problem, I also believe that the slow death of the publishing industry is not beneficial either.


Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:26 pm
Post Re: June 28, 2010: "Fandamonium"
Patrick wrote:
Dragonbeard wrote:
Anyway back to the subject at hand; regarding the history of fandom, are we all forgetting the Beatles? Probably the first "institution" to be obsessed over to the point of madness?


What about Elvis?


Yes what about Elvis... I'm not really sure myself, did he have as much merchandise and shit with his name on it? Either way, My point was that Star Trek really was only the first of it's kind in television, not overall as was implied in the article.


Thu Jul 01, 2010 3:21 pm
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